Finally lowering the monte...
#21
10-01-2010, 02:33 AM
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: over here
Posts: 2,810
Just to throw a rock into the blender. I would say contemplate skipping the short dog bones and going with cradle spacers. From my research I went with the spacers instead of the shorter dog bones. Not to step on the toes of those that have them and believe in them. I believe the spacers are a better option and way to go.
Reason for the spacers/dog bones is when you lower your car the geometry of the suspension and axles get out of natural range for the car. Putting stress on parts that before didn't have to deal with. Now in theory the dog bones and the spacers are to help bring these parts back into normal operating range. This is the reason why I believe the spacers are better. First the dog bones only put rotational direction which does bring these parts in a better degree of operation than without them sure. However, there is more of a upward direction of the cradle thus raising the engine and trans physically bringing the parts back into a better operation with the spacers.
Here's a thread to read just to get an idea of someone that did have an issue and decided to go with the spacers after miles of driving.
http://www.grandprixforums.net/insta...ers-31503.html
Now don't get me wrong I don't have all the facts and this is a rinsed down version. Not by any means perfect and that could be worded and changed. I didn't know the in's and out's of lowering these cars but I've done a lot of research for myself and went to many forums for these cars and their are a lot of different views on this issue as well as other issues. But do the research yourself learn and see both sides of the issues. The very least you learn about how things work. If you don't already understand the reason for the dog bones or in my opinion the better option and cost the same from zzp the craddle spacers
Reason for the spacers/dog bones is when you lower your car the geometry of the suspension and axles get out of natural range for the car. Putting stress on parts that before didn't have to deal with. Now in theory the dog bones and the spacers are to help bring these parts back into normal operating range. This is the reason why I believe the spacers are better. First the dog bones only put rotational direction which does bring these parts in a better degree of operation than without them sure. However, there is more of a upward direction of the cradle thus raising the engine and trans physically bringing the parts back into a better operation with the spacers.
Here's a thread to read just to get an idea of someone that did have an issue and decided to go with the spacers after miles of driving.
http://www.grandprixforums.net/insta...ers-31503.html
Now don't get me wrong I don't have all the facts and this is a rinsed down version. Not by any means perfect and that could be worded and changed. I didn't know the in's and out's of lowering these cars but I've done a lot of research for myself and went to many forums for these cars and their are a lot of different views on this issue as well as other issues. But do the research yourself learn and see both sides of the issues. The very least you learn about how things work. If you don't already understand the reason for the dog bones or in my opinion the better option and cost the same from zzp the craddle spacers
#22
10-18-2010, 09:22 PM
does anyone have a picture?? i'm still not sure where you would install this cradle spacers.
I see the ones from w-bodystore look like they go on the 4 connecting points of the cradle/subframe (http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/...cers-p-70.html ) so lowering 1/4" all the components sitting on the cradle which make sense if you want to lower the center of gravity.
But the spacer that the guys at grandprixforms are using look different and are being used to what looks like heightening the engine and transmission by adding spacer to the mounts.
Is this opposite of what you would typically want which as i understand is to bring the weight closer to the ground to improve estability and be less "top heavy" ?
I see the ones from w-bodystore look like they go on the 4 connecting points of the cradle/subframe (http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/...cers-p-70.html ) so lowering 1/4" all the components sitting on the cradle which make sense if you want to lower the center of gravity.
But the spacer that the guys at grandprixforms are using look different and are being used to what looks like heightening the engine and transmission by adding spacer to the mounts.
Is this opposite of what you would typically want which as i understand is to bring the weight closer to the ground to improve estability and be less "top heavy" ?
Last edited by albert1; 12-22-2010 at 12:47 AM.
#23
10-27-2010, 03:31 PM
Can I install these "shortened dog bones" without having to support the engine or anything. An easy install in the driveway???
Can I install the anti-pogo washers without removing the strut. From the pics it looks like I simply remove the main nut and pull the stock cap/washer off and screw on the new anti pogo one while everything is still in the car. Looks like an easy job????
That ZZP website is grand prix specific but are you guys saying this is the stuff we need? Are the dog bones engine specific? I have a 3.5L.
-Steve
Can I install the anti-pogo washers without removing the strut. From the pics it looks like I simply remove the main nut and pull the stock cap/washer off and screw on the new anti pogo one while everything is still in the car. Looks like an easy job????
That ZZP website is grand prix specific but are you guys saying this is the stuff we need? Are the dog bones engine specific? I have a 3.5L.
-Steve
#24
10-27-2010, 03:43 PM
Can I install these "shortened dog bones" without having to support the engine or anything. An easy install in the driveway???
Can I install the anti-pogo washers without removing the strut. From the pics it looks like I simply remove the main nut and pull the stock cap/washer off and screw on the new anti pogo one while everything is still in the car. Looks like an easy job????
That ZZP website is grand prix specific but are you guys saying this is the stuff we need? Are the dog bones engine specific? I have a 3.5L.
-Steve
Can I install the anti-pogo washers without removing the strut. From the pics it looks like I simply remove the main nut and pull the stock cap/washer off and screw on the new anti pogo one while everything is still in the car. Looks like an easy job????
That ZZP website is grand prix specific but are you guys saying this is the stuff we need? Are the dog bones engine specific? I have a 3.5L.
-Steve
Yea the struts can remain in tact while swapping the washers.
Grand Prix = same chassis as Monte Carlo. What everybody is talking about in here is 3.8L, not sure about cross compatibility
#25
12-08-2010, 10:03 PM
I dont want to jack your thread, but it seem like everyone who knows stuff on the subject is here... lol
What lowering set would lower the front the MOST? Like 2" OR MORE would be nice! My front sits way high due to the system in the trunk.
Thanks. Thanks.
What lowering set would lower the front the MOST? Like 2" OR MORE would be nice! My front sits way high due to the system in the trunk.
Thanks. Thanks.
Last edited by Jordanshedd5; 12-08-2010 at 10:32 PM. Reason: Additional Info
#26
02-28-2011, 05:25 PM
OK, Obviously by posting on this thread i am looking to lower my Monte. (02 SS) as you could tell by my name. I just want to make sure i don't need anything else before starting it.
Here's what i have/ what I'm ordering
KYB Gr-2 Struts
Eibach Pro Kit
Engine/Tranny Mounts (i need new dogbones anyway so if i get the shortened ones will i still need new motormounts?)
Antipogo washers
I feel like I'm forgetting parts that I'm going to need, please let me know if you can think of anything.
Here's what i have/ what I'm ordering
KYB Gr-2 Struts
Eibach Pro Kit
Engine/Tranny Mounts (i need new dogbones anyway so if i get the shortened ones will i still need new motormounts?)
Antipogo washers
I feel like I'm forgetting parts that I'm going to need, please let me know if you can think of anything.
#27
03-01-2011, 08:34 PM
You can get new bushings for your dog bones no need to replace the dog bones them selves unless you decide to go with the shortened dog bones. Motor mounts themsleves don't in a sense have anything to do with the increased axle geometry; the shortened dog bones or the spacers are the only two options to help with this issue. If your mounts need to be replaced replace them.
#28
03-02-2011, 11:37 AM
This is the reason why I believe the spacers are better.
Just make sure you get the right spacers. There are sets made to lower the engine/cradle to clear the hood for an intercooler, and sets to raise the engine a bit for lowered cars.
#29
03-04-2011, 07:29 PM
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mountains of Utah
Posts: 4,903
I have installed the Eibach's over 2 years ago and have not had any issues related to them. Mine Eibachs are Black, get the RED ones if they are available by the manufacturer of the springs you select to ultimately use, however I dont think it will really effect the appearance of the car if BLACK springs are used as one can not even see them unless you really climb under and look for them, all you see is about 4 inches of spring coils and again thats if you really are looking for them under the wheel well and above the tires. So to powder coat them or paint them red is more about ahving an eye to really detail the car for competition. Do you pull any of the tires off at car shows to display calipers and such?
I have installed the all BMR suspension components and the KYB AGX struts. Used the ZZP aluminum dog bones, not the shortened ones and no cradle spacers and have not experienced any abnormal vibrations. Use BF Goodrich G-force tires and they wear okay.
I have installed the all BMR suspension components and the KYB AGX struts. Used the ZZP aluminum dog bones, not the shortened ones and no cradle spacers and have not experienced any abnormal vibrations. Use BF Goodrich G-force tires and they wear okay.
Last edited by ZIPPY02; 05-26-2013 at 12:48 PM.
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