04 monte is it actually worth the money and time to replace the solid body brake & fuel lines yourself? Looks like a good flare tool is round 200 for brake lines. Fuel line req tooling uknown. Mech told me it be 500-600 to replace only brake lines from b-nut front to rear.

 

No one will be able to give you an easy yes / no without understanding what they look like / what your ability level is.

My thoughts:
-You absolutely do not need a $200 flare tool. Ive done sections of mine with a $20 tool from Jegs (that you can probably rent for free from Autozone).
-Jegs has like a $70 kit with everything- lines, fittings, cutter, and flare tool. None of it is high quality, but you're also not trying to equip yourself to make this a full time career.
-Are the lines really completely shot front to back? I've run all new fuel line (to upgrade size) and replaced sections of brake line due to rust through. My rust through happened at a couple very specific bends. I moved a few inches each way to cut it off and the line was 100% intact. I wouldnt redo every inch unless you absolutely had to.
-If the lines are really destroyed front to back, how is the rest of the car? Is it even worth saving? The lines are a cheap repair but if the body is rusting through too, I'd be hesitant to put a penny into it.
-Without question its a lot of labor to do the whole thing. I don't think your mechanic estimate is too far off, theres a good bit of labor involved. Replicating all the bends is a lot of labor.
-One other thing- theyve got that nickel copper brake line now thats 1000% easier to work with compared to traditional steel.

 

I bought pre-formed brake lines from some place online, can't remember the name of the place at the moment. They were stainless steel lines - the complete set, like 8 pieces - for about $250. I took them to my guy, and he said they weren't the right ones, didn't know if he was punting, or they weren't right. I had the Chevy dealer do it, they said the lines weren't quite right but they made them work. They said if they had to make them (the front to back lines) they would be $90 per line for nickel copper - which is two brake lines and two fuel lines. They said my fuel lines were ok, and just did the brake lines. The place I bought them from, It was Inline Tube now that I think about it, also had nylon fuel lines, but only for 3.8L and I only have a 3.4L, and they said they were different.

The bad news is - if your lines are rusted, your undercarriage is rusting up too. I had to take mine off the road to repair all the rust damage, I wasn't going to get it done on 'nights and weekends.' I'm not giving up on the car, I bought it new, and I plan on it being in my funeral procession!

Good luck, and if you need help, holler.

 

The lines are not completely rotted every inch. 1 lines is rotted completely through. Brake lines are rotted through or close from the body front bend up, every clamp location across the bottom, and the aft bend up area on both the fuel lines and brake lines. From what i can tell the brake lines use a special bubble flare tool. fuel lines use im not sure yet aside from the special bubble gm fuel line flare. I do not work on cars professionally, that being said i pretty much do everything myself. I have the gm manuals for my car and use them often with a std actron code reader only. I would like to get a brake / fuel line set thats worth having for all cars that will last. Even though the cars dont seem to last anymore. Eastwood seems to have a set for that 400 bucks for almost all applications except stainless that i was going to use for the fuel lines. The under carriage on the car is in somewhat decent shape, ob not new. Most of it is sprayed black unsure if undercoated but it seems the monte carlos ive seen in the junkyard have this undercoating type stuff. My grand prix practically identical does not and it is rotten on borrowed time, took an exhaust sys for the gp from monte in junkyard and had only minor rust in comparison. Both cars pretty much have lifetime warranty suspension parts i have already replaced over the years. The man hours to do this fuel and brake line job i hate to think about let alone outside without a lift, but with proper tooling it can be done faster with less headaches. I was going to get the copper nickel brake line material for ease of use and durability corrosion resistance. I usually size a job for tooling and parts vs labor. If they are equal i usually do it myself if i can to gain the tools and experience. However, with lots of projects going on juggling things is getting more difficult. The quote was 500-600 just for the brake lines b-nut to b-nut labor only. Fuel lines were not included. Splicing is an option, but not a good fix with the other areas of the lines looking close to rot through. Quick splices are also not cheap.

 

So its everything on the flat bottom of the car from firewall to gas tank? If thats the case, that's all I'd replace. The fewer bends you have to do and the more open an area you have to work with, the better.

No doubt the best way is replace every inch, I just hate throwing out good factory line (assuming it is good where it arcs up with the body to the termination point), its just more time and money with no benefit.

I will say I'm not suggesting splicing out each bad spot - Id certainly string them togethetogether long splice to replace all of the bad spots. I did something similar on mine as I had 1 blown out spot and another sketchy looking spot less than 10" away that I did with a single repair piece.

Thats why I'm suggesting just replacing the bad section- you don't have to worry about any of that. You just cut out the bad part, then flare the new line and remnant of the stock line to match the fittings / union you're using and you're done.

Don't buy oddball fittings / unions and you can use a regular old flare tool.

My counter to that is - how many line replacements are you really planning to do the rest of your life? It would take an awful lot of line replacements to make a $400 tool worth it over a freebie Autozone rental (or the basic $30 tool to buy it). Thats what I mean - if you were opening up a brake job shop or something it would definitely be worthwhile to get the nice stuff. Heck before used car prices started getting crazy you could've bought a whole running / driving high mileage W body car for not much more than that.


I'm just saying, you could probably knock this whole thing out for less than a couple hundred bucks if you don't go crazy on high end tools.


Have you thought about just doing compression fittings on the fuel lines? Id not ever suggest them for brakes as its safety critical and can theoretically exceed the pressure limit, but basic EFI fuel pressure is well within the bounds of compression fittings. That would save you from flaring anything on that circuit- just chop out the rusted bottom section, comp fitting old rear to new middle to old front and be done with it.

 

Craig 32. Found stainless lines ready to go bent and flared all fuel and brake for 630 with shipping. Considering going that route as it should save a lot of time for bending and flaring etc and at least 350 in tooling. Cant help myself if i were to buy tooling and fabb myself i would fabb for limetime even though the car wont last that. The only thing that concerns me is whether the brake lines that run left to right forward and aft can even be replaced with access and space available being pre-made or whether they wont fit and would have to be twerked just to get them in. Has anyone replaced all the brake lines pre-fabbed?

 

So, I can give you some feedback on this topic. I *JUST* went through it on my blue 2004 Monte (which has not seen winter since I bought it in August of 2008).
1. - I have used nylon fuel line repair products. Work darn good!
2. - I have done a LOT of brake line repairs over the years. I typically but the flaring nuts and coils of tubing, unions and go to town. I normally use steel tubing that is pre-coated with a rust preventing paint. I can bend it safely by hand (as long as I am NOT making sharp bends). Others use the nickel/copper blend (NiCop for short). NiCop is nice because it should not corrode and is softer to work with.

Now, I have flared brake line usually with a tool like this (and you can usually borrow one from the autoparts store):
Many of the flaring tools look like this, but the quality does vary (I prefer the craftsman one I normally use).

BUT, my game changer is this tool:
https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-on...16-tubing.html
I bought it on some crazy sale at Eastwood over a year ago, used it once and blew my mind! SO EASY and way LESS clumsy than the other tool.

As for stainless lines, I would only spend the money (and I did in my case) depending on the condition of the rest of the car and how long you expect to own it. I leveraged a company called InlineTubing.com. The stuff they originally sold me did not first right and they had me ship my old lines in and they hooked my up very good!!! I also re-used my original nylon flex lines that go to the engine. DO NOT use Dorman quick connect fittings! Thanks to a friend telling me this, I went to NAPA and bought SUR&R quick connect fittings. InLineTubing flared the stainless fuel lines to accept the quick connects for me. Job was awesome once it was done.
I will post another thread about my fuel/brake line drama with pics and details.

I spent the time and money on this stainless line adventure because I only drive the 2004 Blue Monte during nice weather and I have ZERO plans of getting rid of the car (and I have some OCD topics with this car). If this was my daily driver (like my 2004 Grand Am is), then I would have gone a far less expensive route! I would have gotten coils of line, flaring and did it that way (like I have done a bunch of times).

So, long winded, I hope I gave some helpful information. Look for another thread coming soon on my mess lol. And feel free to ask questions.

 

FYI - I made a detailed post with pics about my brake and fuel line saga.... Here is the link.
https://montecarloforum.com/forum/mo...45/#post726679

 

Definitely helpful. Thank you. More information and learning is always good. I have some of those cheapo flare tools, but i just dont want a further hassle if i was going to fabb the lines with already having to bend and trying to minimize time. Good tools go a long way to alleviate headaches and reduce time. I did see the eastwood flare tool and was so tempted to get it. The only thing i didnt like was its fare type capability was limited. I like the flare styles and even later option for an fittings for the mastercool flare tool for almost the same price. Doesnt seem like it has the tube depth head like the eastwood has to set the tube in the dies for essentially no hastle. I was thinking of modding to nylon fuel tubing, but worries me on the undercarriage that its only held by some rinky dink plastic snap fittings and i def wouldnt want it to sagg or chafe around on the metal. I wanted to use nicopp, but again it worried me the soft material for crushing flanges and for road fod on the undercarriage. Seems like it would be easy to take damage and even easier to fold over at bends. That said i did find metal coil fod protector for these lines but i would want it over the lines in wheel well and undercarriage. I was thinking of going plano steel for cost, even coated steel since the factory lines have made it this far, but really i dont like repeat maint for the same stuff. I want the lifetime fix 1 and done, even though cars never last. I am prob just going to buy all stainless from inline tubing, may even paint. When i totaled fabb materials plus tooling it was so close think id rather save the time and just replace all together and be done. Monte seen all northeast weather with salt and such. Love the car. Want it to last forever, but cant always get what u want. Thanks for the information to everyone again.

 

Keep in mind, that Eastwood tool is your most common brake line size and makes the most commonly required flare. It may be limited, but limited to a very common need and made to be somewhat easy to use (I was thrilled with mine).

Just a couple final thoughts before you purchase anything (and these are strictly my opinions, at the end of the day you need to do what you are most comfortable with).
1 - If this is a car that you see running another 5-10 years, then stainless is a very worthwhile investment. If it were my car and it was a daily that I only expect 5-10 more years from, I would use coated steel for brake lines, and nylon for fuel. Keep in mind, GM and other vendors use nylon for various parts of the fuel line system. Installed properly, it will not be an issue and it's pretty easy to work with.
2 - If you do still want to go stainless from inlinetubing.com (which I used for my 2004 and recommend), a couple of thoughts. First, if you have the non-Supercharged L36. then they should have the exact fuel lines they did for me and able to re-produce. I recommend that!! You can then re-use your original nylon flex lines that connect with the engine (either with a sharkbite style fitting or using the SUR&R quick connects I mentioned). And don't worry about the pinch clamps. They are easy to install and when properly installed, you will not have any issues. I do not know the fuel line differences in the the 3400 LA or Supercharged L67. And brake lines, assuming the car has ABS (which I know some Impalas did not have, but not sure about the Montes), I recommend getting the lines without the flex pieces by the ABS block. Less potential issues in my book and easy to deal with when all the lines are out of the car.

I admit, there were some bumps in the road with my stainless line install (and it prompted me sending InlineTubing my original lines). But all said and done, they stood by their work and set me up as best they can and I am happy with the outcome. If you have not seen the pics in my other thread, please do!