We already have a few guys at work that auto cross/track day racers that want one of these.I would take a black FR-S

 

This car actually sounds pretty sweet. I just graduated college, so this hit home a little for me. My monte has 150,000 on it and I'm looking for a new car soon. I have always loved coupes and this is a pretty good looking little ride especially for a toy. I would probably only buy American branded cars, but most people my age would not. 200 horse doesn't sound like much especially from a 4cyl. The torque is probably even lower (one thing I don't like about import engines...) However, the car is probably VERY light and that power can go a long way! The best part is that it is RWD! I hate front wheel and six speed for around $20k? I might be sold but then again, I like having "SS" on my cars...

 

I think it's going to be a fun ride 4-Sure...I'm really looking 4ward to seeing one & driving one when they come 2 the USA & Canada...
I'd get a all Black & Murder it `Out I'd also get the 6speed stick ~> & then `go drift'in



"Dreams R where we want 2 `go & work is how we get there" ~> I'm work'in towards my Dreams..

Get one 2 & we can race Oh, keep dreaming, cause dreams are still `free

Thanks everyone for your posts/comments/opinions...
I hope GM is still reading our threads/posts & thinks about a competitive product

 

GM says "Reminder this one " ?


2009 pontiac solstice coupe ? & the Saturn Sky ?
They did not last 2 long : ( What's next GM ? get back in2 the game we know you can, we know you have

 

2012 GT 86: Toyota Isn't Asleep at the Wheel


An engineer from the Japanese giant speaks, and his words say volumes about the company's direction.


By Sam Smith December 2011

• 

“There is a Toyota standard for designing new cars. [Here,] this standard was to a large extent ignored."

–– Toyota engineer Tetsuya Tada, on the creation of the 2,600-pound GT 86 sports car.


Toyota's GT 86 was unveiled at the Tokyo Motor Show this week. The model, part of a joint engineering project with Subaru, is set to hit our market next year. It comes at a time when Toyota is running hard but seemingly adrift, topping sales charts but devoid of interesting or compelling product.

The press has made sport of bashing the company's efforts, but few people have the guts to put up a solution. Here we're discussing a problem that many car companies would love to have: a devoted, loyal fan base that buys cars without needing to be addressed on an emotional level. Persuading someone to want something illogically is hard work; persuading a person to make a purchase based on logic is much easier. With a few notable exceptions (FJ Cruiser, Land Cruiser), you buy a Toyota because it makes fiscal sense, not because it sets your heart racing.

Only now there's this. The GT 86 is a 2,600-pound, rear-wheel-drive, flat-4-powered sports car. When it goes on sale next year, it will be relatively affordable. And it might be exactly what Toyota needs. <!--EndofExcerptMarker-->

In order to wrap your head around the GT 86, you need a bit of perspective. Check this out:
This image depicts the GT 86 superimposed on top of a Ford Mustang and a Hyundai Genesis Coupe and behind a Mazda MX-5. It appears to be to scale (the high-resolution version, for those who geek out over such things, is here). The Toyota is the black thing just barely longer and taller than the MX-5. To put this in perspective, a Mustang is not a large car. Nor is a Hyundai Genesis. The lesson here? The GT 86 is tiny.

Tiny is good. For one thing, no one currently makes a hardtop sports car this size and sells it in this country. (The GT 86 will likely be brought here as both a Subaru and a Scion model.) For another, small car means light car, and light means responsive and fun. The GT 86 isn't set to produce that much power; its direct-injected 4-cylinder engine produces just 197 horsepower and 151 lb-ft of torque. Acceleration times should be close to those of a Genesis Coupe or MX-5 -- fast but not earth-shaking.

We need more cars like this. You can now buy 600-horsepower Corvettes and Nissan supercars that all but drive themselves -- but power isn't everything. We cannot continue to build ever faster cars, especially when a lot of them aren't a lot of fun at ordinary, sane speeds. This car -- this Toyota -- is an antidote to that. It makes sense. It is good.
The Truth About Cars (TTAC) recently attended a track drive of the GT 86 in Japan. While there, they spoke to Tetsuya Tada, the car's chief engineer. He had some pretty revealing things to say. You should hit the above link for the full dose -- it's worth it, I promise -- but here are a few choice excerpts:

On Akio Toyoda, the company's CEO, and his role as GT 86 test driver:
“Mr. Toyoda almost continuously participated in the development of this car. Not as president, but as a test driver. Usually, when they say that the president of a company is test-driving a prototype car, it is mostly ceremonial. Mr. Toyoda’s participation was not simply ceremonial. He was a serious test driver and had some pretty tough comments. In some phases of the development, he said, “If that is the best you can do, why not quit now?” One by one, we overcame these problems.”


On Hiromu Naruse, Toyota's legendary late test driver:

“When Naruse-san was still alive, he participated in the tests many times and gave us some quite harsh comments, like, 'This is a miserable car. You are doing very poorly.'"





The point is, building cars to Toyota's typical standards apparently wasn't enough -- the GT 86 required a different approach. Given how entertaining are the brand's current offerings (i.e., not very), that's good to hear.

And finally, the most revealing comment:


“We visited with car enthusiasts in Japan, America and Europe. The feedback we received was almost always the same. They said there are a lot of sports cars with high horsepower that are very fast, but these are not the sports cars that they want to have. They want small, compact cars that are controllable, that they can tune themselves. However, that kind of sports car is not on the market. Therefore, these sports-car enthusiasts are forced to continue to use older cars from a long time ago, because there is no new alterative on the market.”


Again, check out the TTAC piece for the full dump -- Tada has a lot more to say, including some amusing stuff related to the car's marketing. It's all very promising.

Granted, this is the message Toyota wants to send. I doubt the company is so cynical as to give Tada a script, but I also doubt that his PR minders didn't strongly suggest emphasizing the car's role in Toyota's enthusiast-oriented rebirth. (Watch newsstands in a few months. My money's on the world's car magazines pitching lines like "TOYOTA: BORN AGAIN WITH THE GT 86?" Or maybe something with the soulless word "mojo" in it. This is a fun business, but it's also kind of predictable.)



At the root of this is the consumer issue: A car company cannot survive on bread-and-butter models alone. The father with five kids buying the minivan needs to be able to look longingly at the sports car across the showroom, hoping to make it there one day. The 30-year-old buck signing the note on a new roadster needs to have a place to go when his family outgrows his testosterone. Smart brands use the idea of options and destinations to retain customers in the long run. It just makes sense.

In that light, Tada's quotes are encouraging. They hold the key to undoing the damage caused by years of lazy product decisions and the unfortunate unintended-accelerat<WBR>ion scandal. The big T desperately needs good marketing vibes and an affordable halo car in showrooms, and it needs the street cred that such a car fosters. This might do it.

 

I would certainly own the Subby over the Yota

 

Found one 4 U...Merry Christmas EnJoy, Oh what color did you want ? LOL

================================
First Drive Review


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• VIEW PHOTOS (77)
• Specifications>

• 
  
  
  VEHICLE TYPE: front-engine, rear-wheel-drive, 2+2-passenger, 2-door coupe
  
  ESTIMATED BASE PRICE: $25,000
  
  ENGINE TYPE: DOHC 16-valve flat-4, aluminum block and heads, port and direct fuel injection
  
  Displacement: 122 cu in, 1998 cc
  Power: 200 hp @ 7000 rpm
  Torque: 151 lb-ft @ 6400 rpm
  
  TRANSMISSIONS: 6-speed manual, 6-speed automatic with manual shifting mode
  
  DIMENSIONS:
  Wheelbase: 101.2 in
  Length: 166.9 in
  Width: 69.9 in Height: 51.2 in
  Curb weight: 2800–2900 lb
  
  PERFORMANCE (C/D EST):
  Zero to 60 mph: 6.0–6.2 sec
  Zero to 100 mph: 15.5–15.7 sec
  Standing ¼-mile: 14.7–14.9 sec
  Top speed: 143 mph
  PROJECTED FUEL ECONOMY (C/D EST):
  EPA city/highway driving: 19/27 mpg
  

<HGROUP>2013 Subaru BRZ

Hype, validated: This rear-drive Subaru has the goods.



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• December 2011
• BY JARED GALL

Some things just don’t make sense. Why is the food at Outback Steakhouse mostly Cajun-style? Why can’t Jennifer Aniston find true love? And why would Subaru and Toyota, two companies whose fortunes are built on mainstream sedan sales, collaborate on a rear-drive sports car?
The latter question is a bit easier to answer from the Subaru BRZ perspective. For one, Subaru has a currently breathing reputation for building sporty cars: They may sell in limited volumes, but the WRX and STI are nevertheless Subarus. And Subaru says that the engine in its BRZ, a 2.0-liter flat-four making its first public appearance in this car, will form the basis of its next turbo motor. For its part, Toyota says that its version of the car—to be sold as the Toyota 86 in Japan, as the GT 86 in at least the U.K., and as the Scion FR-S here—makes sense as a first thrust in its plan to again build sporty, fun-to-drive vehicles. Still, this isn’t a car that most people saw coming from either manufacturer.
Cheese Fries, Please!
Then again, regardless of the boomerangs mounted on the walls and the “Chaze Frois, Plaze!” coasters, Outback Steakhouse’s Alice Springs chicken is delicious—and devastatingly unhealthy, but that’s beside the point. The BRZ is likewise delectable; our only gripe about the way it drives is a chassis that leads to understeer at the limit. That, however, is much less likely to give you a heart attack than a jumbo honey-mustard-marinated chicken bosom hidden under a pile of bacon and smothered in melted cheese. Indeed, right up until the nose starts to chatter off line, Subaru’s new coupe is gifted with exceptional balance and clairvoyant reflexes.
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The understeer isn’t a deal-breaker; with perfectly timed and moderated inputs (or with huge, pimp-slap jerks on the wheel and heavy stomps on the go pedal), it is possible to avoid it all together and turn it into delicious oversteer. When the rear end goes, even in the wet, the BRZ slides slowly and progressively. It’s so easy to catch that you might find yourself fishing in your pocket for spare change with one hand while the other meters yaw around an off-ramp. (Subaru says that Toyota’s suspension tune will vary slightly, a tad softer in the front and stiffer out back.) The brake pedal feels a little less wired than the rest of the car, but the binders wind the speedo back toward 0 in a hurry.
Conducting the chassis is steering that is more immediate than anything this side of the Lotus factory. Its heft is perfect for resisting unintentional inputs at the limit. Feedback falls short of perfection, but only slightly; blame the electric steering if you must. The electric motor assisting the BRZ’s rack is mounted high up on the firewall, contributing to a slightly higher center of gravity but simultaneously shifting the front/rear weight balance a touch rearward.
Weight Watchers
In developing the BRZ, Subaru took an almost maniacal approach to weight and its management, keeping it low and evenly distributed between the car’s axles. The company claims that 54 percent of this car’s mass rides on the front wheels and 46 over the rear, and says that its center of gravity is right around 18 inches high. That latter figure rivals or beats the measurements for the Porsche Cayman and Mazda RX-8, among others.
Helping keep the mass snug against Mother Earth is the FA flat-four. Compared to the FB four found in other Subies, the FA’s intake is 2.6 inches lower and the oil pan clings closer to the crankcase, allowing it to be mounted with its crankshaft centerline 2.4 inches lower. Amazingly, the engine is mounted 9.4 inches farther back in the chassis than an Impreza’s four. A Subaru spokesman says the two engines share “maybe a few screws,” but are otherwise completely separate pieces. We’re told the weight difference between the two is negligibly in favor of the A. Placing the engine so far rearward of course helps balance the car, but it also precludes Subaru from fitting an all-wheel-drive system. The company says that it has no room for a turbocharger either, but after peering under the hood, we disagree. Besides, Subaru desperately needs something to tie this car to the rest of its lineup, and a turbocharged STI model would be the perfect solution. Although the BRZ doesn’t need more power, it certainly could handle more. We’re guessing that a turbo will be part of whatever mid-cycle updates this car sees in two or three years.
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Despite a displacement difference of just 3 cc, the naturally aspirated FA and FB fours have dramatically different outputs. The B’s 148 hp and 145 lb-ft of torque (as installed in the Impreza) lag 52 and 6 behind the A’s 200 and 151—Subaru’s stated output—while the A’s 7400-rpm redline is 800 higher. Thank Toyota’s fuel-injection setup, which squirts both via intake ports and directly into the cylinder—the system is Big T’s lone contribution to the engine—and allows a crushing compression ratio of 12.5:1. “Crushing” is not a descriptor we’d employ for the acceleration, although we estimate a 0-to-60-mph time of around six seconds flat with the six-speed manual; add a couple of tenths with the six-speed auto. Top speed is said to be 143 mph. A resonator pipes sound into the cabin, and above 5000 rpm, there’s enough noise inside the car that you’ll need to scream to talk. Not that you’ll be having much conversation. That said, we wouldn’t call the quality of the sound unmistakable; it could be taken for a number of undesirable things. Having heard what aftermarket exhaust companies do for other Subaru flat-fours, though, we’re confident that they can coax a better voice out of this 7400-rpm screamer.
In spite of its higher output, the FA should still manage 30 mpg on the highway, according to Subaru. Underbody paneling helps keep a clean aerodynamic profile, although the company still hasn’t decided if the treatment will be standard on all U.S. cars or only on higher trim levels.
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Even the Weenies are Treated Well
As mentioned, two six-speeds are available, a manual and an automatic. Following our drive of the BRZ in Japan, the manual had us seeking a temple at which we might make an offering of thanks. The clutch pedal is a touch light—and a touch light on feel—but snaps to attention right off the floor and engages smoothly, and the stubby shifter snicks between gates with ease. Heretics who buy their sports cars with automatics will at least get a good unit. There are two modes in the Subaru: Drive and Sport. Wheel-mounted paddles are standard; in D, the transmission allows them to make gearchange suggestions but still upshifts at redline and downshifts when the driver floors the accelerator. In Sport mode, however, paddle commands are gospel—the way God’s lazy, automatic-driving half-brother intended.
While most of the engineering and chassis work is Subaru’s doing, the styling fell to Toyota. It apparently drew a basic coupe shape and—well, it must have seen it created something less than sultry but stuck with it anyway. It’s good enough. The view from abaft is actually fairly exciting, with the slope of the greenhouse hesitating just slightly to form a decklid before tumbling into the rear fascia. Only the front fascia, badges, and maybe wheels separate the BRZ from its Toyota—and Scion—sibling. The suggestion of flares on the front fenders merely alludes to the muscular (some might say exaggerated) styling of the various concept cars, but the U-shaped view from the driver’s seat over the scooped-out hood is at least unique. Visibility in all directions is much better than most sports cars.
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Interior space, on the other hand, is just about par. It’s fine up front, and average/shortish adults might even be happy in the back for shorter trips. Subie touts this as the shortest rear-drive 2+2 on the market. So it is. It also says that the car can accommodate a forward-facing child seat in the back. A rear-facing seat, on the other hand, would probably only fit if the parent riding shotgun rides shotgun in a car following behind. The trunk will hold just seven cubic feet of stuff, although both halves of the rear seatback fold for larger loads. According to Subaru, the space was designed from the beginning to hold a set of racing tires and a toolbox in this configuration, although that claim coincided with a PowerPoint slide entitled “Unexpected Utility”; we suspect that’s probably the real story behind the tire-hauling ability. Or maybe that’s why the tires are just 215 millimeters wide, as fitting a set in the car requires a two-tire stack.
The BRZ goes on sale in spring of 2012 as an early ’13 model, at a base price we’re now told will be around $25,000. Asked to make sense of the BRZ, a Subaru representative says, “It makes sense if you sell enough of them.” In the U.S., Subaru thinks that 5000­ to 7000 per year would be enough. Ultimately, though, a car this good doesn’t need to make sense: Its brilliance is all the explanation we need. View Photo Gallery
<NAV class=mod>PHOTOS (77)

 

I had a heart to heart with the Deuce....
After she got done laughing she said... "She ain't worried"