Burn out
#31
RE: Burn out
i notice when you floor it with these cars... the weight comes off the front wheels, so i think it is probably easier to peel rubber with a FWD than a RWD with similar power and weight. i dunno... i've seen camaro's with 3.8's struggle to do what i can do with this car (i'll ahve to get those videos on)
#34
RE: Burn out
As a former drag racer I'm going to chime in here. When you launch a rear wheel drive car, the weight transfers to the rear, and you are essentially trying to lift the entire car (ever see a wheelie?) In a front wheel drive car, you are only lifting the front of the car, so the front wheels will unload, and will spin easier, as will a rear wheel drive car if you floor it in reverse. There's a lot of physics involved to explain it, but I have not been an engineer in too many years to start spouting off about force and vectors etc. Also, the issue of torque steer has been eased as front wheel drive cars have matured in technology. The problem was really bad in early front wheel drive cars that had unequel length halfshafts. When you are spinning a shorter, lighter shaft on one side and a longer heavier shaft on the other you get torque steer, equal length halfshafts tend to eliminate this.
As far as front wheel drive being better in snow, yes there is more weight above the drive wheels, which will help with traction. Also, your pulling the car rather than pushing, ever see a horse push a wagon? It does not work out too well for the horse. The biggest factor in snow driving is the tires, A 4 wheel drive truck with bald tires does not move very well. I drove many rear wheel drive cars in winter, and with good snowtires and a light foot you can even drive a 350 TPI powered IROC-Z in fairly deep snow. Been there, done that. I do prefer FWD for snow tho' and I love the way the Monte has handled the last 2 storms.
John
Sorry for the long boring post, I guess I got on a roll.
As far as front wheel drive being better in snow, yes there is more weight above the drive wheels, which will help with traction. Also, your pulling the car rather than pushing, ever see a horse push a wagon? It does not work out too well for the horse. The biggest factor in snow driving is the tires, A 4 wheel drive truck with bald tires does not move very well. I drove many rear wheel drive cars in winter, and with good snowtires and a light foot you can even drive a 350 TPI powered IROC-Z in fairly deep snow. Been there, done that. I do prefer FWD for snow tho' and I love the way the Monte has handled the last 2 storms.
John
Sorry for the long boring post, I guess I got on a roll.
#35
RE: Burn out
Here's a pretty good article on the subject:
http://www.canadiandriver.com/winter/020619.htm
Regarding traction in the snow, some experts today claim that modern traction control systems give RWD cars the same traction in snow as FWD. Having driven RWD police cars for thirty years (with and without traction control),I know for a fact that this is total nonsense.As most of us older guys know, the only way to get around reliably in the snow with a RWD is to use snow tires, and put a bunch of weight in the trunk. This is not necessary, of course, with FWD because the weight of the engine and transaxle is over the drive wheels.
I owned a 97 Lincoln Mark VIII, which I never drove in the snow. However, one winter day I backed it outonto the driveway so I could sweep out the garage.There was a couple of inches of icy snow on the ground at the time, and it wouldn't move an inch when I tried to pull it back in - even though the driveway is level.The only way I couldget it back inside was to put about200 pounds of weight in the trunk. On the other side of thegarage, my wife's PT Cruiser went out andin withouteven breaking traction.
From the performance aspect, there's never been a FWD Corvette, and I think it's safe to say that there never will be.
I think the 06-07 SS provides the best of both worlds - a V-8 coupe that will go 0-60 in less than 6 seconds, but can also get around in the white stuff without having to fill up the trunk with sand. It won't corner with most sports cars, but who gives a crap? The Monte Carlo is not a Miata.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/winter/020619.htm
Regarding traction in the snow, some experts today claim that modern traction control systems give RWD cars the same traction in snow as FWD. Having driven RWD police cars for thirty years (with and without traction control),I know for a fact that this is total nonsense.As most of us older guys know, the only way to get around reliably in the snow with a RWD is to use snow tires, and put a bunch of weight in the trunk. This is not necessary, of course, with FWD because the weight of the engine and transaxle is over the drive wheels.
I owned a 97 Lincoln Mark VIII, which I never drove in the snow. However, one winter day I backed it outonto the driveway so I could sweep out the garage.There was a couple of inches of icy snow on the ground at the time, and it wouldn't move an inch when I tried to pull it back in - even though the driveway is level.The only way I couldget it back inside was to put about200 pounds of weight in the trunk. On the other side of thegarage, my wife's PT Cruiser went out andin withouteven breaking traction.
From the performance aspect, there's never been a FWD Corvette, and I think it's safe to say that there never will be.
I think the 06-07 SS provides the best of both worlds - a V-8 coupe that will go 0-60 in less than 6 seconds, but can also get around in the white stuff without having to fill up the trunk with sand. It won't corner with most sports cars, but who gives a crap? The Monte Carlo is not a Miata.
#36
RE: Burn out
Gale, you are 100% right. I am currently assigned a former PD Crown Vic Police Interceptor, and was responding to a car fire during a snowstorm last week with it. After a couple of slides I shut down the lights and siren and continued with traffic, the car just would not get good grip. (I investigate fires, so I can slow down if neccessary, the Engine continued at full speed, but they weigh a LOT more, and have retractable tire chains.) The Crown Vic has great tires, but they are pretty wide and it has ABS, but not traction control.
When I was driving my IROC-Z or my '86 Monte SS I would put studded snows on the rear, and would drop down from 16 inch 245's to 15 inch 215's in the case of the IROC. I also put around 200 pounds of sand in the trunk.
The best handling car I've ever owned was my '99 Trans Am, it just hugged the road. It was also the most powerfull, the LS-1 engine is fantastic. I got caught at work one day with it when we had a surprise snow squall. I drove home at 5 mph and was not sure I would make the 4 mile ride without going into a ditch, and it had traction control and ABS. It even had tires that were rated as M and S. Needless to say I also had a 4 wheel drive Silverado for winter use at the time.
John in snowy New Hampshire.
When I was driving my IROC-Z or my '86 Monte SS I would put studded snows on the rear, and would drop down from 16 inch 245's to 15 inch 215's in the case of the IROC. I also put around 200 pounds of sand in the trunk.
The best handling car I've ever owned was my '99 Trans Am, it just hugged the road. It was also the most powerfull, the LS-1 engine is fantastic. I got caught at work one day with it when we had a surprise snow squall. I drove home at 5 mph and was not sure I would make the 4 mile ride without going into a ditch, and it had traction control and ABS. It even had tires that were rated as M and S. Needless to say I also had a 4 wheel drive Silverado for winter use at the time.
John in snowy New Hampshire.
#37
RE: Burn out
ORIGINAL: 07MonteSS
I also wanna know what torque steer under hard acceleration you are talking about...I have stomped on the gas and still get none!
I also wanna know what torque steer under hard acceleration you are talking about...I have stomped on the gas and still get none!
ORIGINAL: Gale155
Having driven RWD police cars for thirty years (with and without traction control),I know for a fact that this is total nonsense.
Having driven RWD police cars for thirty years (with and without traction control),I know for a fact that this is total nonsense.
#38
RE: Burn out
Here's a pretty good article on what causes torque steer (RWD fans will love the suggestion on how to avoid it). http://www.mph-online.com/mag/streetknowledge/003
#39
RE: Burn out
They have improved on the torque steer issue with FWD vehicles, but it's still there. The issue is more noticable as the HP increases. I didn't notice it at all with my 2001 SS but it was more pronounced in my 2004 S/C SS, and even more sowith the 2007 SS. Not really a problem, you just have to be ready for it.
As far a FWD in snow, the only problem with the Monte, is ground clearance. Every FWD car I have had, will simply walk through snow. I have never had a RWD vehicle that would do that. I don't know if the "new" traction control systems will help that much on RWD stuff, but I just can't see them coming close to a FWD in snow.
As far a FWD in snow, the only problem with the Monte, is ground clearance. Every FWD car I have had, will simply walk through snow. I have never had a RWD vehicle that would do that. I don't know if the "new" traction control systems will help that much on RWD stuff, but I just can't see them coming close to a FWD in snow.
#40
RE: Burn out
Speaking of burnouts, check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auHO-PnhyS4
The guy in the BMW has got to be crazy! Quite honestly, I'm impressed with the second guy. [:-]
The guy in the BMW has got to be crazy! Quite honestly, I'm impressed with the second guy. [:-]