Some of you may have seen from my previous posts that we moved a couple years ago to get out of a HOA and to get into a bigger lot (either with an existing larger garage, or at least with the space to add one - we ended up with the latter).

Unfortunately the garage plans got delayed quite a bit because the house itself was a bit of a wreck. We spent the several months living in a rental house to get the core fixes done before we moved in (100% new flooring - including more than half as strip + redo tile, raising a sunken living room, fixing concrete slab issues, etc). We're now getting the house to a point where its mostly done besides cosmetic stuff (back splash, paint, etc), so its time to focus on a garage.

Got through step 1 - custom made building plans (6 month lead time by the time it was all done), so I'm now ready to start.

Already ran into snag #1 after submitting the permit. It got rejected because the city code only allows 1 "accessory building" and the house came with a freestanding covered patio / grill area next to the pool which is over the allowable size for a ramada (which is supposedly 150 SF max, but we're a little over double that). The downside is that I really like the covered area as its our main place to stay cool when hanging around outside / not in the pool. I also put substantial effort into fixing it as the roof had completely failed (zero remaining covering, OSB crumbling at the joints, rotted out headers, etc) and just rebuilt the roofing system 100% from scratch a year or so ago.

The crazy thing is, its a blanket rule for residential lots that probably makes sense on the normal cookie cutter sub .2 acre lots like we used to live in, but we've got over an acre now (with a relatively small house on it). The only other core requirement is you can't have more than 1/3 of your lot under some kind of roof - so we could literally build a 10k SF accessory building, but a 300 SF ramada and a garage is absolutely a no go.

My options:
1 - variance. Not really an option. The same guy that rejected the permit is the guy that advises on approval of variances and he says he wouldn't advice acceptance because there is no undue hardship causes by the rule.

2 - tear down the ramada. Not real thrilled as we use it so often.

3- reduce the ramada size so it falls in the actual ramada category which takes it out of the accessory building category. The downside is that the limit is 150 SF max - a bit under half the current size. We'd have to completely gut all of the built in stuff for that small size to make any sense (theres a full size fireplace, built in concrete seating, a bar, a grill area, etc - its a really nice setup that someone paid a ton of money for.

4 - scrap the garage plan. Also not really an option as that was the whole point of moving in the first place.

5 - a little outside of the box, but I could connect it to the house to change it from a freestanding ramada into an extension of the covered patio (which has no limits besides the lot area % coverage requirement). Its a pretty odd idea as we'd have to literally replicate the whole structure again to fill the gap (and it would cover the shed), but it may be enough to check the box to let the garage move forward. Downside of course is its a fairly good sized expense + time drain just to be allowed to build a garage.


Not sure what to do at this point, but definitely not happy with how things turned out. To make things worse, a previous person had already reached out asking about it, and he approved all of our outside structures, but this other guy in the review process doesn't.

 

Don't you *love* how you can own property and be restricted on what you can do with it? I say that, but I also understand some of the reasons for these types of restrictions (some people would way over do things and drag a neighborhood down).

I am honestly not sure what to advise, other than I personally don't like the sound of ripping any of your structures down or reducing their size. Perhaps but the garage as an add-on to them, maybe....

I am in the boat of trying to get pricing to have my dream garage/workshop built. Problem is getting pricing OR realistic pricing (one guy quoted me pricing that is over 50% the cost of my home, and if you knew where those topics sit, that was ridiculous).

 

I'd be a lot more understanding if there was some logic behind it. I could literally build a 10k sq ft behemoth back there as long as it was a single building. But a normal garage + 300ish SF shade area (with 3/4 acre of open grass still remaining) is just unfathomable.

I pushed on that topic a bit as a basis for a variance, and he didn't want to hear it / try to explain how it would be detrimental to the city / neighbors. It makes the logic even more muddy when I can (in theory) build even 1 more structure (to essentially connect the free standing ramada to the house to make it one giant 'covered patio' - thatll literally be 60 feet long) and that's perfectly OK. IMO thatll look worse than just approving a variance, but they'd rather do whatever meets the existing rules regardless what looks best.


The other thing that bugs me about the situation is that there are other people that have exactly what Im looking to do:

1 - several neighbors with similar large lots (for a larger city) have multiple separate structures. I strongly suspect they're just unpermitted as many of them would be impossible to see from the road driving by.

2 - there are multimillion dollar properties around the city with similar sized lots (generally 1-1.5 acres) that have several extra buildings. One in particular has a large detached garage, a pool house, a casita, and a giant shaded ramada. Im sure they've got all of the paperwork/ variances to allow that - but it sure makes you wonder how they got it through... (know someone that owed them a favor or paid someone off to pass it)

My goal is to try to preserve as much open yard as I can between the house and garage, so I'm trying to push the garage as far out to the back as I can (without violating the absurd setback rules). So it'll be very far from the pool and such.

I'm strongly considering the option of just connecting the ramada to the house to turn it into a giant 'covered patio' as part of the house. It seems really absurd, but its better than tearing the existing area down or making it unusably small.

I really hate to take on a big construction project just before an even bigger one, but that's shaping up to be the best option. As long as I can get the concrete pad down for the garage before summer hits again, I'll be happy.

That sounds like where I was a year or so ago. The goal here is to build a realistic dream garage, but my timing is poor.

I'd originally planned on a steel building (red iron supports with sheet metal around it), but the price spike from $75k (already fairly high IMO) to $130k with covid steel prices. To make things worse, the city has a clause that the accessory buildings must be "architecturally compatible" with the house and they informally told me I'd have to stucco it to at least make it look like the house (which is a huge expense for a steel building since the sheet metal can't support any weight, so you've got to build a wood support structure).

I've shifted gears and pivoted to wood now. Had custom plans drawn up for exactly what I wanted. My plan at the moment is to farm out the concrete work and do 100% of the rest myself. I think thats the only way I keep this at any kind of reasonable budget.

 

So, I am curious what it takes to consider connection the ramada to the house. Does it require just a covered walkway or a side walk? How simple can this be accomplished (and least expense). But I agree, this is all building out to be ridiculous. The other properties may have been done before current ordinances or the current people enforcing them. Or could be they are the high dollar homes and the owners were being catered to.

I owned the vacant property since 2014 where my home now stands. So I signed papers fall of 2019 to build my home. Man, did my timing luck out! I got in at a point where I was not negatively affected by the covid/2020 issues. I am thankful I got my home built before everything took a huge swing from Covid. I got my keys to the new home June of 2020. But my plan was always to build a nice house (with an attached garage) and then build my dream garage. My original want was to have a partial 2nd floor in the back, gambrel roof (looks like a barn) and so many people quoted crazy pricing OR wanted architect stamped drawings (and this was shortly after getting into the new house through 2020 and 2021). So, fine, as of the moment, I have simplified things. No second floor, I want 32x50ft with a ceiling height of 16ft, standard gable roof (which uses per-engineered trusses). I just started putting out for pricing on this. But it is a much simpler of a project (I can build the second floor myself from the inside). I want the concrete, framing, siding, and roof it (no electrical or insulation). I found materials (minus concrete, doors and windows) from the local Home Depot is $15k. I know that concrete will be a huge part of the cost. But I had one guy telling me it's $165k for him to have a crew to build. Which I find ridiculous! I did get another quote for $86k (which I feel is still a bit high). But still fishing to see what is out there.

 

I think thats got to be my next step - feel out what bare minimum he would accept (unfortunately its just a single individual, and its not defined in the code book what constitutes a "connection" to the house). He did mention 'you can't just connect the two with a single board'.

The odd thing visually is the entire area between the house and ramada is all concrete, and the shed takes up about half of that space - the full width of the ramada. So if I just did a narrow 'walk way' covering, it clearly would just be a check the box kind of exercise as it would pass directly over the center of the shed (and look a little odd too) so it could never be actually used as a walkway.

I think what would visually look best as a permanent installation would be just duplicate the existing ramada width (about 14' wide at the roof line) all the way to the house (probably 25-30 feet). We could potentially move the shed at some point elsewhere in the yard and just expand the amenities of the existing ramada to fill out that added covered space so its not too strange. I'm just not excited about the construction as it'll be a good sized bit of work that I'll have to DIY to have money left to do the garage too.

I suppose I could always do a narrow covering to get through garage construction, and then just take it down and store it until we sell.

They're mostly brand new builds - at least within a year or two of the start of covid. Given the steep increase in house prices (practically doubled in the last 4-5 years), some of the less wealthy rich people were getting priced out of their typical zip codes - particularly people new to the area. So they've been buying up these acre + properties in traditionally middle class neighborhoods, tearing down the old 60s/70s house on it and build a monster house from scratch (and still likely $$$ ahead from not buying a premium lot in the typical rich people zip codes).

Wow, that'll be a nice size! That's about what I'm looking to do (40x50x10 inside dims) - except I can't go anywhere near that height due to local code. I already have to have a flat/ parapet wall to match the house, so I'm pushing the limits as close as I possibly can.


Thats not bad at all! It looks like wood is starting to finally come down a bit too.

Yeah, I see what you mean - 165 for that sounds nuts! I'd normally think thats their "I don't really want to do that job" price, but things have been absurd out here too.

The toughest thing I've run into (that made me want to go the mostly DIY route) is that I've not been able to get a single company to come out to quote the current project as a whole. Theres just such a labor shortage and (apparently) more than enough work to 100% consume the construction industry in just new construction of subdivisions.

The only complete quote I ever got was for that steel building company because they've got no connection to the new construction housing industry besides sharing concrete suppliers.

 

I got thinking if you had to build some form of covered path from the house to the ramada to satisfy the "connected" requirement, find the absolute cheapest way to check the box. Perhaps a DIY project. Once all projects are done, rip it down. At that point the structures are built, permits completed and people like this guy you are talking about will probably never follow up. This is some serious nonsense and wasteful spending. It really sounds like this guy you are dealing with enjoys a power trip since he basically indicated to you he would deny a variance for your garage things stand. I am curious, if you applied for a variance and it truly got denied, is there a higher level to appeal it to?

I wanted an very spacious garage. Goal is to get my Camaro in there (and actually make efforts to work on restoring it), store both montes and bring in a 4 post drive on lift. Plenty of space for other things like a big air compressor, cabinets for tools, work bench and who knows what lol. The second floor would be great for some general storage. I was thinking eventually mimic a friend's garage and use a house furnace on the second floor to blow heat downward. The ceiling height would help accommodate the lift and have a couple ceiling fans. And I wanted the space to be generous so it did not feel like you are going to ding car doors to open any of them. At that point, my attached garage would FINALLY be free and I could actually park my daily driver in the garage!
Dreams that I hope by next spring are FINALLY a reality.

 

Is a retractable awning allowed on the Ramada ? It would be skating around the rules, but possible the city might allow it. We have a rule in my town where you can't park a trailer, boat , ECT on your lot unless it's on pavement, concrete or similar. And you can only have "X" amount of driveway.
SOme residents have basically read into the rules and found that you can park on patio pavers with no issues. So now there's motor homes , and car trailer's parked along side house's for the winter.

 

Funny you mention that as I went down the same road about a week ago. It is allowed and would seem to be a reasonable workaround as only permanent structures are counted.

The solution I was originally thinking was shade sails (as theyre so common out here as we don't get snow loads, but have lots of sun). I figured I could just cut out 2/3 of the roof while leaving the core structure (essentially cut a giant sunroof into it), anchor D rings into the corners and clip a shade sail in place in the hole. Turns out the planning dept doesn't consider shade sails temporary (although that appears to be 100% opinion on the rules, not actually written anywhere). Regardless, its not written either way, so they have the final word unless you want to go the legal route...

I did look into the exact path you mentioned too. The downside is that the ramada was never built to meet that very tiny square footage requirement. So I'd have to trim off all of the roof overhang (since it counts as covered SF) so I don't end up with a narrow rectangle of permanent roof. Thatll let me have a roughly 12x12 permanent roof - but that doesn't quite hit the middle pillars. So I'd have to leave the entire support structure in place to at least cover 4 of the 6 pillars and just have the roof trimmed back shy of it a few inches (with the rest covered by a movable awning). I'm really worried that would look awful. If the remaining roof at least covered 4 pillars completely, then I think that would be a prime candidate, but the pillar spacing isn't ideal.


I did get informal email approval that they would likely approve a full width extension of the ramada to the house (essentially build another full ramada connecting the existing one to the back of the house roof line). They keep dodging the question via email about if they'd approve anything narrower.

Just to get things moving again, I'm tempted to hand draw some plans to just built a 2nd ramada to fill the gap (between the house and existing ramada) so I can at least get moving on something while the weather is nice. I just hate to keep screwing around with the back and forth indefinitely.

 

Well, it's back over the fence again.

Drew up plans (by hand) over the weekend to connect the ramada to the house to make it all one giant covered patio. Hoping its an easy approval as I'm almost exactly duplicating the existing ramada structure (the size and shape of the gap between the two is within half a foot of the current ramada size and shape). Kinda hard for them to reject it when they've already approved a structure like that at some point in time.

The one thing I do worry about for rejection is they do say the plans are supposed to be 24"x36" pdf - and mine are just hand drawn on standard 8.5x11 since it's so simple (although its across 5 separate sheets for the different views / details). If they do reject it for that, I'll just buy some cheap home design software.

Had a change of plans on the shed too (which is under the proposed addition). Something needs done with it as its too tall to fit under the covered patio addition. Id planned to just chop the roof as its an excessively high peak, but my wife wants it moved across the yard. Thatll be another fun project - pouring another 10x12 slab and moving the shed probably 150 feet (as it can't go in a straight shot due to the pool).

 

You might try this to do a pdf for the plans. I have done it works great.
Take a picture of the plans with your phone, set it a highest resolution, best if you don't use an Iphone. Then email it to yourself and open it up on the Computer, save the files as a pdf and then download and send them to the folks at the Building inspection dept.

Back in the 70's I was first married and we owned a small house for about 2 years and I wanted to have a Garage that was more than a single car space, and attach it to the house.
This was small town Iowa.
There was a light pole in my back yard that had a guywire on it and it was going to turn out to be inside the Garage on one corner about 3 feet.
Battled with the city on this and they were non-compliant on any resolution except to move the pole and guy wire and wanted $800.00 to do that.
So after some research at the Court house I got a plot plan of the area and it indicated there was a 15 foot area in the rear of the property for a Utility Easement.
So I looked over the area and measured the distance between the pole and the guywire and where the pole was on my property and low and behold the thing was outside the easement no matter where you located either one.
Now I asked them for a meeting and showed them my findings and they were back peddling.
I said you know I was here to be a nice guy and asked about a solution and no one wanted to work with me only wanted to get alot of cash.
So now we should probably move that guywire or the whole thing? Haha
Now they came up and broke out a fancy guywire cutter and cut the thing off, wrapped it around the pole and said they would have to replace that one of these days in the near future.
That was 45 years ago or more, we travel back to Iowa once a year to see friends and I always drive by the old house to see what it looks like and the guywire is still wrapped around the pole.
The Moral of this story is when you are Honest and want to do things correctly people with lesser scruples want to really get you.