i'm sorry i'm new to monte carlos and this forum lol
#21
05-13-2009, 03:21 PM
what kind of headers should i be looking for? i am checking ebay for used stuff .. can't seem to find any that will fit our block size.. they are all for v8.
#25
05-13-2009, 05:31 PM
I wouldn't spend $300 on a K&N intake if I were you. You can make something much better for 1/10th of the price pretty easily. Look around here, and you'll find instructions to make a cold air intake or a fenderwell intake. There really isn't much to it at all.
As far as the 3800performance order: I can't see your product basket, so you might want to try linking each individual item.
When you're searching for parts:
Keep in mind that the L67 was put in the grand prix gtp and buick regal gs in 1997, so if you're searching for anything engine related they will most likely be listed for those cars.
There are a few different brands of headers that are available on ebay. All of them are basically copies of one of the original designs. Basically SLP came out with a header design years ago, and so did Pacesetter. There are two smaller brands that came out with 3800 headers as well: The Other Guys (aka TOG's), and S&S.
Usually the SLP and the TOG designs are considered the best out of those four, as the Pacesetters are hard to install and seem to leak for everyone unless you modify them. The S&S headers have smaller primaries and smaller collectors so they were geared more towards the N/A engines than the supercharged engines. You can find a comparison of all of the headers on the W-body store website listed below.
At some point a couple of different companies started copying the SLP and the Pacesetter designs.
You should be able to find a brand called either SSautochrome or XSpower on ebay which are SLP copies made of stainless steel. They run under $400 (people were getting them for around $250 for a while through some discount - the details are on clubgp if you search for SSAC). There are a few other chinese SLP knockoffs, but some of the brands are made incorrectly so double check what you are buying (they literally bent the crossover pipe the wrong way).
Most of the other ebay brands are Pacesetter knockoffs, and probably aren't worth the money.
Recently ZZP came out with their own header design that eliminates the downsides of both the TOG's (their crossover) and the SLP's (the downpipe design), and they are supposedly the easiest headers to install and are made of high-grade stainless steel. They aren't cheap though (around $700 w/o the downpipe).
there are a few vendors besides 3800performance. I've never dealt with 3800performance, as it seems like most of their stuff is a bit overpriced.
ZZperformance.com <--- They are the biggest vendor by far, and do the most product R&D. Most of the stuff they carry is the highest quality you can find of all of the vendors (but not all, so research what you buy). They also ship extremely fast. If you need information on their products, your best bet is to ask on a forum - they are pretty short with their emails (they most likely get 100's of emails a day so it makes sense). They are switching their focus to the Cobalts it seems, but are still big in the W-body scene.
W-Body Store <-- A pretty good vendor, they are still making products for the 3800. They used to be kinda slow with shipping and updating the website, but have supposedly revamped their business. Always a pleasure to deal with though, and very helpful if you have questions.
INTENSE racing <---Intense was the second biggest W-body vendor, and in very direct competition with ZZP (they have a long history of being friends, and then hating each other it seems but I don't know the whole story). They get a bad rep from people who are ZZP worshippers, but Intense is helpful if you email them and they ship very quickly as well. They are switching their focus to the G8's now though, and aren't coming out with anything new for the W-body.
Triple EdgePerformance <-- This guy is known as Trannyman95 on some of the forums, and is a transmission guru so to speak. He is incredibly helpful if you have any questions at all, and won't try to sell you something you don't need (which surprised the hell out of me). He also does engine work and tuning as well. His prices are great for his built transmissions, and they are possibly the best that their is right now.
PRJ Performance<--- This guy has forgotten more than most people know about these cars. His fuel related products (fuel rails, fuel pump and fuel pump rewire, injectors, etc.) are top quality. His plug wires are also great too. They are custom made and are big as hell. If you end up changing your plugs often then his plug wires are easy to remove and are very durable so they won't break. This guy is also incredibly helpful and very friendly and his shipping is very fast.
There are a few other forums around that I would suggest researching any mods before you buy them.
All of the forums have classified sections as well, and that would be your best bet for finding parts you need (headers, etc). Most of the forums are busy enough that people don't put stuff up on ebay.
Clubgp.com/newforum - this place is loaded with info. Most of the people on there are a**holes though. Sort through the bs and you'll find some knowledgeable folds. Check through the L67/L32 engine section under the '97-'03 Grand Prix forum for info. Clubgp is very ZZP biased, so keep that in mind as well.
Oh, and the classified section on clubgp is very active and there is always tons of new stuff listed every day. You're bound to find a good deal on there if you're both fast and patient.
3800pro.com - Much more friendly than ClubGP, but not nearly as busy of a forum. This forum was started by Intense, and is run by them so keep in mind that the whole forum is biased towards that vendor.
Grandprixforums.net - Probably the most friendly of all of the grand prix forums. Almost as busy as clubgp, but doesn't have nearly as much info. Seems like people post bad information fairly frequently, so make sure you sort through the bs on that forum too.
Good luck.
-Riggs.
As far as the 3800performance order: I can't see your product basket, so you might want to try linking each individual item.
When you're searching for parts:
Keep in mind that the L67 was put in the grand prix gtp and buick regal gs in 1997, so if you're searching for anything engine related they will most likely be listed for those cars.
There are a few different brands of headers that are available on ebay. All of them are basically copies of one of the original designs. Basically SLP came out with a header design years ago, and so did Pacesetter. There are two smaller brands that came out with 3800 headers as well: The Other Guys (aka TOG's), and S&S.
Usually the SLP and the TOG designs are considered the best out of those four, as the Pacesetters are hard to install and seem to leak for everyone unless you modify them. The S&S headers have smaller primaries and smaller collectors so they were geared more towards the N/A engines than the supercharged engines. You can find a comparison of all of the headers on the W-body store website listed below.
At some point a couple of different companies started copying the SLP and the Pacesetter designs.
You should be able to find a brand called either SSautochrome or XSpower on ebay which are SLP copies made of stainless steel. They run under $400 (people were getting them for around $250 for a while through some discount - the details are on clubgp if you search for SSAC). There are a few other chinese SLP knockoffs, but some of the brands are made incorrectly so double check what you are buying (they literally bent the crossover pipe the wrong way).
Most of the other ebay brands are Pacesetter knockoffs, and probably aren't worth the money.
Recently ZZP came out with their own header design that eliminates the downsides of both the TOG's (their crossover) and the SLP's (the downpipe design), and they are supposedly the easiest headers to install and are made of high-grade stainless steel. They aren't cheap though (around $700 w/o the downpipe).
there are a few vendors besides 3800performance. I've never dealt with 3800performance, as it seems like most of their stuff is a bit overpriced.
ZZperformance.com <--- They are the biggest vendor by far, and do the most product R&D. Most of the stuff they carry is the highest quality you can find of all of the vendors (but not all, so research what you buy). They also ship extremely fast. If you need information on their products, your best bet is to ask on a forum - they are pretty short with their emails (they most likely get 100's of emails a day so it makes sense). They are switching their focus to the Cobalts it seems, but are still big in the W-body scene.
W-Body Store <-- A pretty good vendor, they are still making products for the 3800. They used to be kinda slow with shipping and updating the website, but have supposedly revamped their business. Always a pleasure to deal with though, and very helpful if you have questions.
INTENSE racing <---Intense was the second biggest W-body vendor, and in very direct competition with ZZP (they have a long history of being friends, and then hating each other it seems but I don't know the whole story). They get a bad rep from people who are ZZP worshippers, but Intense is helpful if you email them and they ship very quickly as well. They are switching their focus to the G8's now though, and aren't coming out with anything new for the W-body.
Triple EdgePerformance <-- This guy is known as Trannyman95 on some of the forums, and is a transmission guru so to speak. He is incredibly helpful if you have any questions at all, and won't try to sell you something you don't need (which surprised the hell out of me). He also does engine work and tuning as well. His prices are great for his built transmissions, and they are possibly the best that their is right now.
PRJ Performance<--- This guy has forgotten more than most people know about these cars. His fuel related products (fuel rails, fuel pump and fuel pump rewire, injectors, etc.) are top quality. His plug wires are also great too. They are custom made and are big as hell. If you end up changing your plugs often then his plug wires are easy to remove and are very durable so they won't break. This guy is also incredibly helpful and very friendly and his shipping is very fast.
There are a few other forums around that I would suggest researching any mods before you buy them.
All of the forums have classified sections as well, and that would be your best bet for finding parts you need (headers, etc). Most of the forums are busy enough that people don't put stuff up on ebay.
Clubgp.com/newforum - this place is loaded with info. Most of the people on there are a**holes though. Sort through the bs and you'll find some knowledgeable folds. Check through the L67/L32 engine section under the '97-'03 Grand Prix forum for info. Clubgp is very ZZP biased, so keep that in mind as well.
Oh, and the classified section on clubgp is very active and there is always tons of new stuff listed every day. You're bound to find a good deal on there if you're both fast and patient.
3800pro.com - Much more friendly than ClubGP, but not nearly as busy of a forum. This forum was started by Intense, and is run by them so keep in mind that the whole forum is biased towards that vendor.
Grandprixforums.net - Probably the most friendly of all of the grand prix forums. Almost as busy as clubgp, but doesn't have nearly as much info. Seems like people post bad information fairly frequently, so make sure you sort through the bs on that forum too.
Good luck.
-Riggs.
Last edited by biggriggs; 05-13-2009 at 05:35 PM.
#26
05-13-2009, 07:05 PM
I got a set of used TOG headers complete with a catted downpipe for $200 total.
Keep your eyes open for a good deal, as they come along once in a while.
Keep your eyes open for a good deal, as they come along once in a while.
what kind of headers should i be looking for? i am checking ebay for used stuff .. can't seem to find any that will fit our block size.. they are all for v8.
(oil pressure for example)
and i have about 650 dollars to spend out the gate because i saved some money on my loan.
there are a few vendors besides 3800performance. I've never dealt with 3800performance, as it seems like most of their stuff is a bit overpriced.
W-Body Store <-- A pretty good vendor, they are still making products for the 3800. They used to be kinda slow with shipping and updating the website, but have supposedly revamped their business. Always a pleasure to deal with though, and very helpful if you have questions.
INTENSE racing <---Intense was the second biggest W-body vendor,
Clubgp.com/newforum -
btw- great rundown on all the sites! would you mind copy/pasting that to my 3800 mods page if you get a chance? I like the very objective view of them!
#27
05-13-2009, 09:31 PM
thanks so much riggs, that is all excellent information! i don't know much about all this so i apologize profusely for my ignorance... i am just brand new to all this and i am trying to learn but there is not much room for error when looking for used mods.... i appreciate the wealth of information that you all are offering me, i am just finding it difficult to apply all you are teaching me to finding good deals... i never know if things will fit or what motor they are talking about ... i know i have an L67 since i have a supercharged ss... but do the parts from the L32 fit as well? i just have to keep reading and learning...
okay, so make a search on ebay just for 3800 headers? i will post the results after i pull them up tonight.
there is no problem, i had that question answered i was reading the gauge wrong.
that is a very good idea and i have considered it... i have already paid off the next two months of the loan and i really wanted to get just a few mods.... i have a new hobby now i guess lol
that will be a great problem for me because i am so ignorant regarding cars in general.... especially high end machines like the beauty i now own 
What problem is there with the oil pressure?
Honestly- maybe its just me becoming more sensible with age, but if you saved $650 on the deal, and you don't own the car- I'd dump that straight into paying the loan off so you aren't paying interest forever on your loan.
Clubgp has a wealth of info in their searchable topics. You really need to learn to search to find what you need though because stuff gets posted so many times due to the high volume, that you get flamed like crazy for asking basic questions.
#28
05-13-2009, 09:44 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/97-98...1%7C240%3A1318
will these fit?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/97-98-99-00-01-05-Grand-Prix-Impala-Monte-Carlo-Header_W0QQitemZ190301381707QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMot ors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2c4ed8a44 b&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171|65%3A1 2|39%3A1|240%3A1318
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HOOKE...4506.m20.l1116
okay i have found some on the wbody site... http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/...ders-p-17.html they are for 449.99, i think i may be able to find them for cheaper... right now i am about to pay someone to tell me the right parts i need for my car and find them for me... this is making me feel very incompetent...
will these fit?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/97-98-99-00-01-05-Grand-Prix-Impala-Monte-Carlo-Header_W0QQitemZ190301381707QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMot ors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2c4ed8a44 b&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171|65%3A1 2|39%3A1|240%3A1318
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HOOKE...4506.m20.l1116
okay i have found some on the wbody site... http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/...ders-p-17.html they are for 449.99, i think i may be able to find them for cheaper... right now i am about to pay someone to tell me the right parts i need for my car and find them for me... this is making me feel very incompetent...
Last edited by Mikhail Tomasovic; 05-13-2009 at 10:06 PM.
#29
05-14-2009, 01:41 AM
Calm down dude, you'll figure it out.
I didn't know jack **** six months ago when I bought my car, but I'm learning.
Just make sure you do your research, don't jump into anything. Otherwise you'll probably get ripped off.
As far as the other forums.....Most forums (no matter what the forum is about) will straight up flame you if you don't use the search functions and take the time to read through the frequently asked questions before you post questions. Search first, then ask questions and people will help you. This forum is one of the most newb friendly forums that I've ever seen, but we get a lot of people asking the same question again and again so I can see why a forum that has 10x the traffic this one does is more frank. Honestly, it seems like people asking the same questions again and again drives away the people that are more knowledgeable on particular subjects.
About the L32.....
The L32 and the L67 are very very similar. The L32 came on the 2004 and up Grand Prix, while the Monte Carlo and Impala got the leftover L67's. The bottom end on both of them is the same, except for the L32 got a different oil pressure setup and powdered metal connecting rods instead of cast iron connecting rods. All of the 2004-2005 got the same oil pressure setup as the L32, and I've heard that some of the 2004-2005 L67's also got the powdered metal connecting rods. Either way that doesn't really affect you.
The L32 got bigger valve in the heads which is the only difference, but that won't really affect anything you want to do just yet anyways.
The main difference between the two is the top end. They have different superchargers. The L67 uses the Eaton Generation 3 M90, and the L32 uses the Generation 5 M90. They are somewhat similar, in that they use the same bolt patterns to bolt to the lower intake manifold. The outlet on the Gen 5 is bigger, so the lower intake manifold is slightly different on the L32 in that the supercharger air inlet square is slightly longer.
The big difference between the two is the throttlebody and the fuel rails. The L32 uses a drive-by-wire throttlebody, and uses a returnless fuel system.
Almost all of the mods that are available for the L67 are interchangeable with the L32 unless it involves the throttlebody or the fuel lines.
Honestly though, the L67 has been around so much longer that you'll find more mods for the L67 than you will for the L32.
It is a popular upgrade to put the Gen 5 supercharger on an L67, as the Gen 5 was the Gen 3, but redesigned by Eaton and will outflow most ported/polished Gen 3 superchargers.
As far as the three sets of headers......
The first two are knockoffs of the pacesetter brand for our engine. They will work, but are prone to leaking. people often have creative nicknames for their pacesetters such as "pacerusters" or "pace****ters" for a reason.
The third set is for a small block chevy (SBC), which is a V8. those will definitely not work. Those are for the 4th gen Monte (82-88).
Check these out too. They are SLP knockoffs, which is a better design.
http://www.ssautochrome.com/level.itml/icOid/1886
They are a bit cheaper too, and are pretty popular with the clubgp crowd.
Good luck with the searching, and take your time. There's a ton of stuff out there, you just have to sort through it all.
-Riggs.
I didn't know jack **** six months ago when I bought my car, but I'm learning.
Just make sure you do your research, don't jump into anything. Otherwise you'll probably get ripped off.
As far as the other forums.....Most forums (no matter what the forum is about) will straight up flame you if you don't use the search functions and take the time to read through the frequently asked questions before you post questions. Search first, then ask questions and people will help you. This forum is one of the most newb friendly forums that I've ever seen, but we get a lot of people asking the same question again and again so I can see why a forum that has 10x the traffic this one does is more frank. Honestly, it seems like people asking the same questions again and again drives away the people that are more knowledgeable on particular subjects.
About the L32.....
The L32 and the L67 are very very similar. The L32 came on the 2004 and up Grand Prix, while the Monte Carlo and Impala got the leftover L67's. The bottom end on both of them is the same, except for the L32 got a different oil pressure setup and powdered metal connecting rods instead of cast iron connecting rods. All of the 2004-2005 got the same oil pressure setup as the L32, and I've heard that some of the 2004-2005 L67's also got the powdered metal connecting rods. Either way that doesn't really affect you.
The L32 got bigger valve in the heads which is the only difference, but that won't really affect anything you want to do just yet anyways.
The main difference between the two is the top end. They have different superchargers. The L67 uses the Eaton Generation 3 M90, and the L32 uses the Generation 5 M90. They are somewhat similar, in that they use the same bolt patterns to bolt to the lower intake manifold. The outlet on the Gen 5 is bigger, so the lower intake manifold is slightly different on the L32 in that the supercharger air inlet square is slightly longer.
The big difference between the two is the throttlebody and the fuel rails. The L32 uses a drive-by-wire throttlebody, and uses a returnless fuel system.
Almost all of the mods that are available for the L67 are interchangeable with the L32 unless it involves the throttlebody or the fuel lines.
Honestly though, the L67 has been around so much longer that you'll find more mods for the L67 than you will for the L32.
It is a popular upgrade to put the Gen 5 supercharger on an L67, as the Gen 5 was the Gen 3, but redesigned by Eaton and will outflow most ported/polished Gen 3 superchargers.
As far as the three sets of headers......
The first two are knockoffs of the pacesetter brand for our engine. They will work, but are prone to leaking. people often have creative nicknames for their pacesetters such as "pacerusters" or "pace****ters" for a reason.
The third set is for a small block chevy (SBC), which is a V8. those will definitely not work. Those are for the 4th gen Monte (82-88).
Check these out too. They are SLP knockoffs, which is a better design.
http://www.ssautochrome.com/level.itml/icOid/1886
They are a bit cheaper too, and are pretty popular with the clubgp crowd.
Good luck with the searching, and take your time. There's a ton of stuff out there, you just have to sort through it all.
-Riggs.
Last edited by biggriggs; 05-14-2009 at 02:03 AM.
#30
05-14-2009, 01:58 AM
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: S.F. Bay Area
Posts: 774
for the price, cant go wrong with these:
http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...mode=1&smode=1
if your looking for cheap quality headers this would be a great buy, especially since he's selling the catted downpipe with it ready to install to your exhaust. you could probably even talk him down to 450 shipped. they arent brand new, but they dont look too bad to me. especially considering that these headers go for over 700 new, plus another 140 for the downpipe, plus shipping for both. save a good chunk of change.
http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...mode=1&smode=1
if your looking for cheap quality headers this would be a great buy, especially since he's selling the catted downpipe with it ready to install to your exhaust. you could probably even talk him down to 450 shipped. they arent brand new, but they dont look too bad to me. especially considering that these headers go for over 700 new, plus another 140 for the downpipe, plus shipping for both. save a good chunk of change.