Wow. That's a shockingly cool 5th gen.

 

Can you explain what will make having a RWD setup better about the car? And what are the costs for a RWD conversion, what else do you have to change in the car to compensate for this? I'd be ineterested in something like that myself, if it were worth it. I noticed your RPM gauge goes up to 8,000, can the engine actually rev/shift that high? Most V6's I've seen don't have gauges that go over 7. Was thinking your 110MPH speedometer is pretty obsolete in a car like that, thinking about upgrading it to digital, or a 150-160MPH cluster?

 

The gauge cluster (minus the white face change) is still OEM (originally had a 3100)- so its still the same numbers as stock, just a different color. Definitely would never rev to 8000 on a 3800 though, I've heard of people having problems getting too far over 7000 (wierd electrical misfire issues). My cam is supposed to make power into the low 7000 range, but I doubt I'll shift it over 7000 in all honesty.

I have a HUD and BCM setup out of the car I pulled the engine from- already made up a drop in harness too (just need to drop it in, and strip/solder into the factory wires of my monte)- that goes to 199 mph.

I have definitely been considering upgrading the cluster, although I'm currently planning on what will look the best with the least amount of hassle. I really want to avoid replacing all the gauges with aftermarket (no offense to those that do) - I just hate the look of a bunch of individual gauges that look just like every other race car.

What I'd really like to do is get a cluster from something like a newer grand prix (ie the 04+ style) w/ a 160 mph speedo (and the 7k tach would be no big deal, since I shouldn't exceed that anyways):



(just picture the gauges, not the turned aluminum looking piece behind it)

The bad thing is, it seems like it may be more work- I've been trying to find some wiring schematics.

Ok, this is going to take a little explanation...

My first problem is traction. Right now I've got brand new BFG KDW2's in a 245 width- and the tires rub slightly when turning. I could potentially space the wheel out more and stick a 255 on, but 10mm width isn't going to cure the kind of traction problems I have. While I realize that my tires aren't the stickiest thing; I don't want to run slicks on the street (and worry about getting pulled over- and end up having them full of rocks and crap). I suppose I could run DR's (they make some with the same tread pattern as my KDW2's)- but treadwear is comparable to slicks, and from what I've seen, traction doesn't go up enough to make it worth it. I haven't went WOT with my whipple setup yet- but I did go WOT when I had the ported gen 3 M90 on there- non IC (couldn't have been much over 300 whp)- and that thing was all over the place in 1st, and some of 2nd. I've rode in FWD Wbodys that make the kind of power my setup should make- and traction is terrible- spinning from a roll at highway speeds. With a RWD conversion, I can tub the back- narrow the rear end, and run whatever size tire/wheel I want. I don't want to go crazy and add a ton of rotational weight, but I think adding at least 60mm to each back tire should help a lot (along with the weight transfer being in my favor instead of against it).

My second problem is the terrible transmission we have. Almost all of the big power 3800 guys have demodded due to these trannys. Since my trans is mostly stock right now- phase 2 was supposed to be an IC, DP nitrous, and a built tranny. I had been trying to pick between a built 4t65 and a 4t80- but I just can't see spending that kind of money, and still having to worry about the transmission in the long term. In my opinion- the problem is GM doesn't have a transmission that was designed to be behind more than ~300 hp FWD- so I'm trying to double power handling of a trans with mods. With a RWD swap, I could use transmissions made to handle the power in stock or near stock form. A turbo 350/400 in pretty much stock form could handle all the power I could throw at it on a 3800, even dead hooking on slicks (although I want more gearing, not less)- so I figured it would be more unique to go to a manual transmission. Since it won't be a drag car anyways, I can give up some 1/4 mile time for more fun to drive. Plus, a T56 or TR6060 came in cars that made almost as much power as I'm making in stock form, so reliability shouldn't be nearly an issue (with a few minor mods to fix regular issues).

While those are the main two reasons, the secondary benefit would be opening a whole new world of suspension and braking mods. The wbody platform does have some options out there, but the options are nowhere near that of the Fbodys.

Honestly, for the bulk majority of people- I'd say if you want a RWD platform, just buy one. Fbodys, mustangs, GTO's etc are cheap enough- that it would be far easier to just buy one and run with it. For me, thats not an option. My monte was my first car so I plan to keep it forever. Also, I've got so much wrapped up in the engine already- that its going to need some sort of trans upgrade ASAP before I start really getting into it.

Also, I really like having something different. I'd hate to pull up to the dragstrip with the other 20-30 camaros and 30-40 mustangs and have the same car. You've got to figure there are only maybe 20 or so L67 swapped 5th gen montes, should be fewer than 10 currently running- then there are maybe 7 or 8 whipple L67 wbodys- of which maybe 4 run. So I can pretty well garauntee that any show or any drag strip I go to that I'll have the only car like it there.

As for the costs, it really depends what way you go with it. You could take a Fbody chassis and just do a mostly stock swap- if you use one of their transmissions that came with a 3800 (4L60e or T5 I think)- I bet you could do it under $5k if you did all the welding and fabrication yourself. I'm planning on using a transmission that won't bolt up to a 3800 directly, and plan to do other mods in the process, so it will be more.

The idea isn't really as crazy as it seems- GM has done it before (used a camaro chassis mated to a 5th gen monte)- in the green John Moss Monte (although I don't plan to do it identically):

http://www.hotrod.com/featuredvehicl..._v8/index.html

 

its not crazy if you have the welding and fabrication skills. theres a member on here doing it. heres his album. he used to have shots of the trans tunnel and the rear from the interior on there. https://montecarloforum.com/forum/album.php?u=5557

 

Well I'm not in the sort of power range where I'm having traction trouble, maybe from a dig, but that's not too bad. I didn't know high powered FWD setups ran into so many problems..., and thanks for explaining the benefits of RWD for a Wbody, and everything, makes sense and all. I won't have enough time or money to dump that into my car, so I'll take your other suggestion and just buy a RWD car sometime. And I didn't know there were only 20 or so L67 5th generation Montes...that's very few. It's actually one of the things I like about the Monte Carlo, in general any of the generations aren't that common on the streets, especially the high powered ones, which definitely blow peoples' minds.

 

thanks for the link- I don't think I've seen that before.

If you ever get a chance to go for a ride in any high power Wbody- I'd definitely suggest it. Honestly, it just gets irritating getting beatin by lower power cars from a dig just because you can't hook up- and I feel ricey asking for a roll race. I realize the really big power (ie 800-1000+) supras and such do mostly roll races, but I think its kinda dorky with a sub 500 hp FWD car to be asking for a roll. Not to mention, with a positive displacement blower (especially on a 2 valve engine)- your grunt is really down low- unlike say a high revving turbo 4 cylinder; so you end up missing out on one of the best parts of the car without traction.

Thats really just a guess- I don't know how many have been done by people that haven't posted on forums, or how many have been done by Milzy's shop- thats just a guess.

 

and ppl thought i was weird when i said i forgot how sexy ur car was...

 

hey bumpin check this out. its at a car show so dont anyone freak out. its pretty good seeing them converted to rwd.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EseMVIE5RKc

 

all that and he cant afford a full tank of gas =p just messin tho it looks great, how much money would you estimate youve dropped into it?

 

Lookin good Chad.

Great work!