Repair Guide: TECH GUIDE: Monte Carlo SS Sunroof track problem... what to do?
#1
08-03-2016, 12:21 AM
TECH GUIDE: Monte Carlo SS Sunroof track problem... what to do?
DONE!
00' Monte Carlo SS Indy Pace Car Ltd. Edition (Yes, it's RED)
My sunroof won't close. It's scratched the paint. When closing, the tracks appear to "drop" before it really SHOULD drop, hence they drag a bit on the roof (yes, leaving a small, solvable, scratch).
Some useful information: The following models are interchangeable / compatible replacements for 6th Gen Monte Carlo LS/SS 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005
MALIBU 1997 - 2003
MONTE CARLO 2000 - 2005
CUTLASS 1998 - 1999
GRAND PRIX 1997 - 1997 from VIN 292222
GRAND PRIX 1998 - 2008
IMPALA 2000 - 2005
ALLURE 2005 - 2009
LACROSSE 2005 - 2009
Sunroof Parts (decent prices) at Wholesale GM Parts online. of course, they don't provide the ACTUAL GM part number. GRRR!
2000 Monte Carlo Sunroof Parts at Wholesale GM Parts online
Additional FANTASTIC info:
THE (partial) Guide
Step #1: Lubricate the tracks. Run it back and forth. That may just solve your issue.
Step #2: Remove the Glass. Requires Torx T20. There are six (6) screws. remove them, save them and the glass will pop directly upward for removal. The Glass isn't heavy but it is large. If you're not confident, don't try it alone. In the image below, you will see the three shiny screw holes. Same on each side.
Remove from INSIDE the car, in case that wasn't obvious.
X1Bci33.jpg
Step #3: With glass removed, run the roof open and closed to see if you can diagnose the issue on the spot. I had a couple of apparently broken "wheels" sitting in the track. See the images below: If you know what these are or where they belong, please reply to the thread!
yJTlYgM.jpg
2CoOXgV.jpg
Step #4 (if you just need the roof closed): Using the switch inside the car, close the roof slowly. Adjust as required until the roof rails come to a rest, flat in the track. Sometimes, the track won't go all the way to it's final resting position without some assistance. Wiggle the tracks gently to see if you can seat it any further toward the front of the car. Once completed, the glass will reinstall in a fully closed position.
Step #5: Specific to my issue, the tracks appear to be shot. I'll need to replace them. I am calling these folks in the morning: The Sunroof doctor. The Sunroof Doctor
Once I speak to them and get more details, I will continue the saga, but enjoy the video below showing the exact problem I am having:
UPDATE 8/3 - The Sunroof doctor does not carry 6th GEN Sunroofs. So, I contacted a local bone yard (junk yard). I found one from a compatible car (2000 Impala) but this was a bust. After I got it home and inspected, it was more broken than then one I have already. So... I'm going to have them source one for me since the one they sold me is a crap.
UPDATE 8/4 - I found one myself and convinced the bone yard to give me my money back. Enjoy videos of the removal below:
Step #6: Beginning Sunroof removal:
Step #7: Headliner removed to show how it is installed:
Step 8: Sunroof removed: Unplug the motor (you'll have to cut all of the wire TIES to save the wiring currently attached if this is YOUR car). If this is a junk car (as is the case in this video) then I just cur the whole wire assembly as far back toward the rear quarter-panel as I could reach and you can cut the wire ties when you go to prepare it for installation.
Total price for the new sunroof? $80.00 and I got a few trim pieces I needed as well. Sunroof cost was $75 of the $80.
0QCquVp.jpg
UPDATE 8/6/2016: I located a dealer "trim" guy who wanted to do some side work. He has installed the sunroof from the 2001 without any issues for $100. It needs to be re-greased, but it works fine. I will post videos once I have it back from him. As he tells the story, the installation is, basically the reverse of removal.
INSTALL:
Install #1) Headliner is removed, so just need to prepare the original in-car wiring for the install.
Install #2) Plug it all into the new sunroof taking care not to tangle it in the headliner (so there are no tangles when you put the headliner back)
Install #3) While holding the roof securely from below (four hands us better than two) place the roof into the location
Install #4) Place the first bolts into the silver side brackets and snug them hand tight for now. There should be FOUR bolts.
Install #5) Install the other bolts also hand tight.
Install #6) Check the alignment and fit. Adjust as required.
Install #7) Install the four drain hoses at all four corners of the assembly. Be careful not to crack the plastic nipples!
Install #8) BE SURE ALL BOLTS ARE REASONABLY SNUG BEFORE ATTEMPTING THIS STEP. Since the electrical was plugged in a few steps prior, you can use the console to test the roof.
Install #9) Once you're satisfied with the fit, snug the bolts and test it again, if you like.
Install #9) Reinstall the headliner and trim pieces.
Install #10) Test it a final time.
Install #11) Have a cold drink. You've done it.
COMPLETED INSTALL:
Eecff0O.jpg
yeB8aC6.jpg
pWCXSEY.jpg
abJOPn5.jpg
00' Monte Carlo SS Indy Pace Car Ltd. Edition (Yes, it's RED)
My sunroof won't close. It's scratched the paint. When closing, the tracks appear to "drop" before it really SHOULD drop, hence they drag a bit on the roof (yes, leaving a small, solvable, scratch).
Some useful information: The following models are interchangeable / compatible replacements for 6th Gen Monte Carlo LS/SS 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005
MALIBU 1997 - 2003
MONTE CARLO 2000 - 2005
CUTLASS 1998 - 1999
GRAND PRIX 1997 - 1997 from VIN 292222
GRAND PRIX 1998 - 2008
IMPALA 2000 - 2005
ALLURE 2005 - 2009
LACROSSE 2005 - 2009
Sunroof Parts (decent prices) at Wholesale GM Parts online. of course, they don't provide the ACTUAL GM part number. GRRR!
2000 Monte Carlo Sunroof Parts at Wholesale GM Parts online
Additional FANTASTIC info:
In review of you problem description it's hard to tell what went wrong first, but at some time the opening or closing process one of the components failed causing a change of events that damaged other components. One of those components is called the Sunroof encoding positioning module. I believe one of those wheels shown in the photo is one that travels along the track during the opening/closing and strikes a pin signaling the actuator that the sunroof has reached that position and to move on to the next mode of the opening/closing process. If the encoding module is malfunctioning or the pin or wheel is out of adjustment or broken that signal is not relayed, hence failure and damage to associated components is inevitable. Proper adjustment of the timing pins which are a special Kent-Moore tool is critical in achieving proper alignment.
I've attached some guides, some from the factory service manual to help illustrate what I'm talking about. I've never personally had to work on a sunroof, but reviewed a similar problem described by a fellow member in the past and upon review of my factory service manual I learned how the system works.
Chevrolet Workshop Manuals > Monte Carlo V6-3.4L VIN E (2000) > Body and Frame > Roof and Associated Components > Sunroof / Moonroof > Sunroof / Moonroof Switch > Component Information > Service and Repair > Switch Replacement - Sunroof Position Enco (Images are attached at the bottom of this thread if you want to see them)
Kent Moore J 41718 Sunroof Track Timing Pins Set Kit Tools | eBay
I've attached some guides, some from the factory service manual to help illustrate what I'm talking about. I've never personally had to work on a sunroof, but reviewed a similar problem described by a fellow member in the past and upon review of my factory service manual I learned how the system works.
Chevrolet Workshop Manuals > Monte Carlo V6-3.4L VIN E (2000) > Body and Frame > Roof and Associated Components > Sunroof / Moonroof > Sunroof / Moonroof Switch > Component Information > Service and Repair > Switch Replacement - Sunroof Position Enco (Images are attached at the bottom of this thread if you want to see them)
Kent Moore J 41718 Sunroof Track Timing Pins Set Kit Tools | eBay
THE (partial) Guide
Step #1: Lubricate the tracks. Run it back and forth. That may just solve your issue.
Step #2: Remove the Glass. Requires Torx T20. There are six (6) screws. remove them, save them and the glass will pop directly upward for removal. The Glass isn't heavy but it is large. If you're not confident, don't try it alone. In the image below, you will see the three shiny screw holes. Same on each side.
Remove from INSIDE the car, in case that wasn't obvious.
X1Bci33.jpg
Step #3: With glass removed, run the roof open and closed to see if you can diagnose the issue on the spot. I had a couple of apparently broken "wheels" sitting in the track. See the images below: If you know what these are or where they belong, please reply to the thread!
yJTlYgM.jpg
2CoOXgV.jpg
Step #4 (if you just need the roof closed): Using the switch inside the car, close the roof slowly. Adjust as required until the roof rails come to a rest, flat in the track. Sometimes, the track won't go all the way to it's final resting position without some assistance. Wiggle the tracks gently to see if you can seat it any further toward the front of the car. Once completed, the glass will reinstall in a fully closed position.
Step #5: Specific to my issue, the tracks appear to be shot. I'll need to replace them. I am calling these folks in the morning: The Sunroof doctor. The Sunroof Doctor
Once I speak to them and get more details, I will continue the saga, but enjoy the video below showing the exact problem I am having:
UPDATE 8/3 - The Sunroof doctor does not carry 6th GEN Sunroofs. So, I contacted a local bone yard (junk yard). I found one from a compatible car (2000 Impala) but this was a bust. After I got it home and inspected, it was more broken than then one I have already. So... I'm going to have them source one for me since the one they sold me is a crap.
UPDATE 8/4 - I found one myself and convinced the bone yard to give me my money back. Enjoy videos of the removal below:
Step #6: Beginning Sunroof removal:
Step #7: Headliner removed to show how it is installed:
Step 8: Sunroof removed: Unplug the motor (you'll have to cut all of the wire TIES to save the wiring currently attached if this is YOUR car). If this is a junk car (as is the case in this video) then I just cur the whole wire assembly as far back toward the rear quarter-panel as I could reach and you can cut the wire ties when you go to prepare it for installation.
Total price for the new sunroof? $80.00 and I got a few trim pieces I needed as well. Sunroof cost was $75 of the $80.
0QCquVp.jpg
UPDATE 8/6/2016: I located a dealer "trim" guy who wanted to do some side work. He has installed the sunroof from the 2001 without any issues for $100. It needs to be re-greased, but it works fine. I will post videos once I have it back from him. As he tells the story, the installation is, basically the reverse of removal.
INSTALL:
Install #1) Headliner is removed, so just need to prepare the original in-car wiring for the install.
Install #2) Plug it all into the new sunroof taking care not to tangle it in the headliner (so there are no tangles when you put the headliner back)
Install #3) While holding the roof securely from below (four hands us better than two) place the roof into the location
Install #4) Place the first bolts into the silver side brackets and snug them hand tight for now. There should be FOUR bolts.
Install #5) Install the other bolts also hand tight.
Install #6) Check the alignment and fit. Adjust as required.
Install #7) Install the four drain hoses at all four corners of the assembly. Be careful not to crack the plastic nipples!
Install #8) BE SURE ALL BOLTS ARE REASONABLY SNUG BEFORE ATTEMPTING THIS STEP. Since the electrical was plugged in a few steps prior, you can use the console to test the roof.
Install #9) Once you're satisfied with the fit, snug the bolts and test it again, if you like.
Install #9) Reinstall the headliner and trim pieces.
Install #10) Test it a final time.
Install #11) Have a cold drink. You've done it.
COMPLETED INSTALL:
Eecff0O.jpg
yeB8aC6.jpg
pWCXSEY.jpg
abJOPn5.jpg
Last edited by The_Maniac; 10-29-2016 at 09:52 AM. Reason: COMPLETED!
#5
08-06-2016, 11:04 AM
Hey Primaryw.
Great write up up and videos. It's a real asset to the forum to see whats under the headliner and the sunroof components.
I'd like to add some insight to your problem though. The sunroof is actually a very complicated mechanism full of synchronized automation called the Sunroof Position Encoding System, in which each component works in concert with each other.
In review of your problem description it's hard to tell what went wrong first, but at some time the opening or closing process one of the components failed causing a chain of events that damaged other components. One of those components is called the Sunroof encoding positioning module. I believe one of those wheels shown in the photo is one that travels along the track during the opening/closing and strikes a pin signaling the actuator that the sunroof has reached that position and to move on to the next mode of the opening/closing process. If the encoding module is malfunctioning or the pin or wheel is out of adjustment or broken that signal is not relayed, hence failure and damage to associated components is inevitable. Proper adjustment of the timing pins which are a special Kent-Moore tool is critical in achieving proper alignment.
I've attached some guides, some from the factory service manual to help illustrate what I'm talking about. I've never personally had to work on a sunroof, but reviewed a similar problem described by a fellow member in the past and upon review of my factory service manual I learned how the system works.
Hope this helps. Please follow up with your success story including more great photos and videos. Thanks again for the contribution.
Chevrolet Workshop Manuals > Monte Carlo V6-3.4L VIN E (2000) > Body and Frame > Roof and Associated Components > Sunroof / Moonroof > Sunroof / Moonroof Switch > Component Information > Service and Repair > Switch Replacement - Sunroof Position Enco
Kent Moore J 41718 Sunroof Track Timing Pins Set Kit Tools | eBay
Great write up up and videos. It's a real asset to the forum to see whats under the headliner and the sunroof components.
I'd like to add some insight to your problem though. The sunroof is actually a very complicated mechanism full of synchronized automation called the Sunroof Position Encoding System, in which each component works in concert with each other.
In review of your problem description it's hard to tell what went wrong first, but at some time the opening or closing process one of the components failed causing a chain of events that damaged other components. One of those components is called the Sunroof encoding positioning module. I believe one of those wheels shown in the photo is one that travels along the track during the opening/closing and strikes a pin signaling the actuator that the sunroof has reached that position and to move on to the next mode of the opening/closing process. If the encoding module is malfunctioning or the pin or wheel is out of adjustment or broken that signal is not relayed, hence failure and damage to associated components is inevitable. Proper adjustment of the timing pins which are a special Kent-Moore tool is critical in achieving proper alignment.
I've attached some guides, some from the factory service manual to help illustrate what I'm talking about. I've never personally had to work on a sunroof, but reviewed a similar problem described by a fellow member in the past and upon review of my factory service manual I learned how the system works.
Hope this helps. Please follow up with your success story including more great photos and videos. Thanks again for the contribution.
Chevrolet Workshop Manuals > Monte Carlo V6-3.4L VIN E (2000) > Body and Frame > Roof and Associated Components > Sunroof / Moonroof > Sunroof / Moonroof Switch > Component Information > Service and Repair > Switch Replacement - Sunroof Position Enco
Kent Moore J 41718 Sunroof Track Timing Pins Set Kit Tools | eBay
Last edited by plumbob; 08-22-2016 at 09:20 PM.
#7
08-06-2016, 03:31 PM
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Mentor, Ohio
Posts: 12,156
Great information! I see a "to be continued" at the end. Once it's completed, this looks like we (the staff) should move it to the FWD tech info section.