Allrighty then.

So a CAI is a waste on some motors but not other.
Cams are a waste on some motor but not others.

Do you really want me to go on? Because that was what you implied, not me.

ALL MOTORS respond the same way to mods is what I said.

No where in their is a implied meaning that all gain the same measurable amount from the improvement.

What is implied there is simple.
If it will create some kind of H.P. gain in one motor, it will then in all motors.

 

Ahh. That clarifies that. I was thinking you were referring that xyz mod will give 5 hp then every motor will gain 5 hp and it doesn't. It always depends on the numerous different tolerances and how everything matches in the engine. Eg some head gaskets match better than others when the motor is first built.

 

What I'm saying, is I posted up a basic, proven mod list specifically for the L67, but that can be made to work with the L36- and you argue with it. It works, period- regardless what you think or not, it has been proven at the track and on the dyno. If you disagree, then you are obviously not familiar with this engine.

I also disagree with you saying every engine responds the same way to mods. Every engine has weak/strong points. A CAI on a ferrari will not yeild anywhere near the same power gain as a CAI on a civic because much more design work was put in. Another example is our heads- the stock 3800 heads flow pretty bad, so people doing ported heads are experiencing pretty nice gains- however on a 4 valve B16, head porting may not make as much power because the flow of the heads is so much better stock. See what I mean?

I just don't like how you generalize that every engine makes the exact same gains from the same mods. Doing a cam with the same specs on a 1960's ~230cid V6 will not provide the same gains as the same cam on modern 3800- technology has come a long way and there are many other variables.

I have seen people do ubend deletes and drop a couple degrees of knock- which equals more power by giving more spark timing. Even if you make no more power from increased exhaust flow, you still make more power from the extra spark timing- its a great bang for the buck mod, especially when coupled with a downpipe. Its not meaningless on the street unless you are always driving at less than 40-50% throttle on the street.

Not everyone wants to do headers- or has the money to do headers though- there are a lot of people out there that want cheap, simple bolt ons- and a plog/dp/ubend delete is a great bang for the buck.

Doesn't pay off? High 13/ 14 flat 1/4 mile, and roughly 300 crank hp for under $1000 isn't a payoff for a 240 crank hp, high 14 second car stock? Are you on crack? Try and add 60 hp, and cut almost a full second on any other gm v6 for that price with bolt ons- it won't happen.

wtf are you talking about? Do the mods I listed, and the car feels equally as fast around town, and is significantly quicker when you floor it. Who gives a f* about who can go the fastest at 10% throttle? If you aren't having to floor the car to achieve the acceleration you want, then you don't need more mods, because you're not using the car's full potential.

Maybe I'm the only one here who floors it when I want to go fast... lol

You really do a terrible job at explaining yourself- the mods I listed aren't gas mileage mods- gas mileage will remain roughly what it was stock. This is not a 'better gas mileage' thread, its about more power. Regardless how you look at it- making more power takes more fuel-meaning worse gas mileage. You can't add horsepower and use less fuel doing it unless you're running stupid rich to start with (which isn't the case on computer controlled vehicles)

Ok, you posted it so all can see your view point. Now people can choose- do they go your route and follow your twisted explanations- or do they follow the cheaper route, make more power- and follow what has been proven by hundreds and hundreds of people? I'm not making this stuff up- if anyone doesn't believe me- go to clubgp and search for basic bolt on mods, it supports what I have said with 1/4 mile videos, dyno's, etc etc.

Sure the big mods will make more power- it would be great if everyone could go straight to headers, cam, heads, or a big turbo kit- but the fact is, most of us dont have that kind of money- and want the best bang for the buck.

I actually have a lot of people that support my side, all you have is your theory that all engines respond to mods identically- and you have little to no 3800 experience. Seems like a pretty easy choice to me though...

x100

 

Impossible to say- it varies depending on if its an L36 or L67, and it depends on how much knock it has from the factory.

No- not their intake boxes. Their filters are good, but their intake boxes suck. I'm not suprised IATs are higher, they have thin walls and don't seal worth a crap.

They are, especially at a near stock mod level. This point alone proves your ignorance to the 3800 community. Gains from catbacks are proven to show very very small power increases. When you're talking $1000 catback that adds 2-3 whp, or $1000 in bolt ons like I suggest that add 40 whp- which would you choose? I didn't pull those numbers out of my rear either, thats what real people get.

No, we buy what has worked for others. We look at people's modlists, and what they dyno and run in the 1/4 compared to stock- seems pretty simple doesn't it?

Are you trying to say that I'm all talk, and don't really have the stuff I say I do? I'm more than willing to post all I've done, and my mod lists, and various 3800 cars I've worked on locally. I have proof if you're trying to call me out as being a 3800 idiot....

Thats why you stick with the primary Wbody stores in the states, zzp, wbs, intense (depending on your preference)- IMO, its your fault if you're buying your 3800 parts from SuperHongKong dealers on ebay. Thats also why no one reccomends buying the caspers tps mod, and why they don't sell hardly any.

I disagree- take the TB gasket mod on the L67. Sometimes the stock gasket overhangs into the airflow path a bit- you can trim it and improve airflow, this does not mean that every engine will gain power- because not every car has this problem. Same goes with apulley swap. Some stock s/c cars will make more power with a pulley swap because they are conservative stock- however on the 3800, most people who swap pullies end up with significantly more knock- negating any power gain.

My point here is, for the people looking to mod on a budget with the bang for the buck stuff- you're not looking at mods just because they make gains on all cars- you're looking at the specific weakest points of your engine and eliminating them- so you can make the most power for the least money- make sense?

 

Well Bump, I was waiting for you.
I knew you'd be back, you just can't resist showing that you really can not comprehend anything.
If the shoe fits is probably as easy as I can be.

Those stores I was talking about you just listed.
Over half of the stuff listed on their sites is pure junk. Maybe its to look bigger, better etc than the next W body store.
Once you get past the junk, you got more junk, looks theoretically better, but still all in all junk.
Then there are very few parts that actually do make alot of sense, but again its few.

And as far as mileage, you really blew me away with your non understanding of the combustion engine.
From the factory they are no where near as efficient as they could be and that's due to to many factors.
One cost
Second, not everyone wants power that means noise
And the list goes on.
If these you claim are to eliminate restrictions and known problem areas of the 3800 that you think is some special motor, so much different that any other.
Then it is very safe to assume that now the motor is more efficient right?
Right????
Then if the motor has been made more efficient, specially volume metrically, it should show itself at the pump.
I spell it out for you. BETTER GAS MILEAGE.
Less pedal is now required to do things it once did with more pedal effort= BETTER GAS MILEAGE.

You didn't change the cam, go internal so mileage should increase.
If it didn't get a mileage increase and 1/4 mile times dropped, then all you did was push the power curve up to a point only 1/4 type running does it do any good. 98% of the time you do what and 2% of the time you "might" do the 1/4 thing.
Looks to me that 95%+ of the readers are 100% in that 98% range and will never see your 2% fast and furious mentality usage and suggestions.

Then again I may be wrong.
Anything none V-8 will attract Rice like thinking. Just never thought I'd see the day with a Monte being part of it.
Hell the Cobalt guys aren't anywhere near as Rice attituded, and they got the 4 bangers in little cars.

 

You do realize you just said that about 95% of the people on this forum think like ricers then?

 

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Also in my experience when increasing horsepower in my other cars I never saw an increase in mpg. That may be attributed to my lead foot but why add the parts and not use them.

Please refrain from calling people ricers. There is no place for that on this board. Disagree all you want, but keep the other $hit out.

 

I was thinking the same thing.

 

It think if we took a poll on this site Bumpin would be winning on the comprehension issue. He has proven his knowledge for a long time and it has been backed up with accurate results.

He understands many of the unique issues with the L67 engine and others in the Monte Carlo and his theories are typically accurate and his advice is typically right on the money with only opinions that can differ.

 

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