> Supercharger Wastegate - What A Waste! ? <
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> Supercharger Wastegate - What A Waste! ? <
Supercharger Wastegate - What A Waste!
Turbo technology for your supercharger
<article style="font: 11px/normal Verdana; text-align: left; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); text-transform: none; text-indent: 0px; letter-spacing: normal; word-spacing: 0px; white-space: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">
A wastegate is an item typically associated with turbo systems, but Detroit-area Stenod Performance has found great success by weaving them into supercharged engine systems to boost torque. In fact, on a pair of '10 Camaros equipped with identical bolt-on ProCharger centrifugal blowers, Stenod coaxed 60 maximum rear-wheel pound-feet more out of the wastegate-equipped car over the comparable, non-wastegate . At some points on the dyno chart, there was more than a 70 lb-ft advantage.
No matter how you slice it, that's a significant increase, and the path to delivering it is relatively simple--if you're handy at welding and tuning. And it was a solution that Stenod's founder, Joe Borschke, says fits the bill for optimizing blower performance across a broader rpm range. "We've been really impressed with the fit, finish and general performance of the ProCharger systems for . But they don't seem to make as much torque as they do horsepower," says Borschke. "That's primarily a function of the boost curve of the centrifugal design."
When it comes to supercharged power, positive displacement superchargers (Roots and Screw-type) and centrifugal blowers produce it differently. In simple terms, a centrifugal supercharger's boost increases exponentially with engine speed, while a positive displacement supercharger's airflow is linear--with maximum boost occurring very low in the rpm band. That means a Roots or twin-screw blower that delivers, for example, cubic feet per minute (cfm) of air at 2,500 rpm will push 1,000 cfm at 5,000 rpm. A Roots or twin-screw blower makes a small amount of boost whenever the engine is running, while a centrifugal supercharger's boost builds in a non-linear way, much like a turbocharger. As rpm increases, the airflow from the compressor will increase at a faster rate. Because of that, maximum boost is not achieved until the engine's red line, or maximum rpm level. So, the centrifugal "rolls" into its boost, and is generally easier to launch, with a stronger feel through the mid-range and upper rpm levels.
"We've installed, tuned, and dyno tested a bunch of ProCharger systems upgraded to the D-1SC compressor. You can pretty much bank on them making 550 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque at the wheels, with about 8 pounds of boost," says Borschke. "We wanted to get more torque out of them to make the cars feel stronger and more fun on the street. We turned to the wastegate, then started experimenting with smaller-diameter blower pulleys to push more torque higher in the rpm band. "In a , a wastegate bleeds off excessive exhaust gas pressure to regulate the speed of the turbine. It's the same idea with a centrifugal supercharger, the compressor of which performs similarly to the turbine of a turbocharger.
"With the wastegate, we can spin the blower faster to produce greater boost, and bleed off the extra pressure that's not necessary," says Borschke. "This allows the boost to come on much sooner, gaining midrange power--especially torque--that you can really feel on the street. But more importantly, it helps maintain the right boost for to prevent detonation in a stock engine. "Of course, there's a fine line to balance with the size of the wastegate. Stenod uses a 44mm unit on LS3 Camaros, which Borschke reports is plenty large enough. "If you go too big, you bleed off too much pressure and go backwards on power," he says.
"You'll never miss it on the street," he says. "It's a small price to pay for the greater feeling of power in the mid-range. Heck, the right cam change would help alleviate that high-rpm deficiency, too. "Check out the accompanying dyno chart and graphs, you'll see the dramatic differences with and without the wastegate. As Borschke mentioned earlier, the standard kit delivered the expected 550 rwhp/500 rwtq numbers, while the wastegate-equipped car's best numbers were 579 hp and 568 lb-ft of torque to the tires. That's about 6-percent greater horsepower and 14-percent more torque.
A closer look at the numbers is more revealing: The wastegate-equipped car crossed the 500 rwtq threshold by 3,700 rpm. That was 1,000 rpm sooner than the other car, and it held above the 500 mark through 5,900 rpm. The non-wastegate car flirted with 500 lb-ft only between 5,200 and 5,400 rpm. It's a similar story with the rear-wheel horsepower, where the non-wastegate Camaro peaked, of course, at the 6,100 rpm limit. The Camaro with the wastegate hit its peak a few hundred rpm earlier; and it bested the other car's peak prior to 5,400 rpm. Of course, we had to ask about the bottom line on this modification. "Generally, it's about $600 for the cost of the wastegate and installing it," says Borschke. "There are tuning implications, too, so it's better to do it with installation of the kit. It would cost more to retro-fit a wastegate on a car that already had the blower system installed and tuned." So, on a blower system that costs approximately $7,000 to purchase and have professionally installed, the wastegate upgrade represents less than a 10-percent premium. In bang-for-the-buck terms, that seems like a deal to us.
Chevrolet Performance's Blower-Ready LSX376 Crate Engine
Sure, there are plenty of bolt-on blower systems for the 2010 Camaro, but if you plan to really turn up the boost, you'll want to consider a purpose-built short block with lower-compression, forged pistons. That's what you get in Chevy Performance's LSX376 (part number 19171049) crate engine. It combines the economical and strong LSX Bowtie standard-deck block with the Camaro SS' production LS3 engine's high-flow, L92-style cylinder heads and camshaft – along with a durable set of forged aluminum pistons that deliver a blower-friendly 9.0:1 compression ratio that is crucial for avoiding detonation in high-boost combinations. The Chevy-orange color of the iron cylinder block looks great under the hood, too. The LSX376 is available from any Chevrolet Performance Parts dealer (meaning your local GM dealership's parts department) or online at gmperformanceparts.com.
A New Blower Book
Super Chevy contributor and author of the main story above has written a book about supercharging and turbocharging the LS engine, titled--appropriately enough--How To Supercharged and Turbocharge GM LS-Series Engines. It is a full-color book published by CarTech, and went on sale this past June. It covers the basics of forced induction, follows the installation projects of blower and turbo kits, and offers detailed chapters on building an LS engine to support high-boost combinations, with numerous sidebars highlighting real-world projects. Go to Cartechbooks.com for more information, or visit sites like amazon.com to order.
Dyno Chart
<table rules="cols" cellspacing="2" cellpadding="2"><tbody><tr><td></td><td colspan="2">With Wastegate</td><td colspan="2">No Wastegate</td></tr><tr><td>RPM</td><td>TQ</td><td>HP</td><td>TQ</td><td>HP</td></tr><tr><td>3,100</td><td>243</td><td>143</td><td>168</td><td>99</td></tr><tr><td>3,200</td><td>411</td><td>248</td><td>243</td><td>148</td></tr><tr><td>3,300</td><td>460</td><td>287</td><td>335</td><td>210</td></tr><tr><td>3,400</td><td>482</td><td>310</td><td>400</td><td>258</td></tr><tr><td>3,500</td><td>489</td><td>324</td><td>421</td><td>280</td></tr><tr><td>3,600</td><td>497</td><td>339</td><td>430</td><td>294</td></tr><tr><td>3,700</td><td>508</td><td>357</td><td>439</td><td>308</td></tr><tr><td>3,800</td><td>516</td><td>372</td><td>447</td><td>323</td></tr><tr><td>3,900</td><td>522</td><td>387</td><td>456</td><td>337</td></tr><tr><td>4,000</td><td>528</td><td>401</td><td>461</td><td>350</td></tr><tr><td>4,100</td><td>537</td><td>418</td><td>458</td><td>357</td></tr><tr><td>4,200</td><td>543</td><td>433</td><td>466</td><td>371</td></tr><tr><td>4,300</td><td>549</td><td>448</td><td>472</td><td>385</td></tr><tr><td>4,400</td><td>555</td><td>463</td><td>479</td><td>400</td></tr><tr><td>4,500</td><td>561</td><td>479</td><td>488</td><td>417</td></tr><tr><td>4,600</td><td>564</td><td>492</td><td>493</td><td>430</td></tr><tr><td>4,700</td><td>566</td><td>505</td><td>491</td><td>438</td></tr><tr><td>4,800</td><td>568</td><td>518</td><td>493</td><td>450</td></tr><tr><td>4,900</td><td>567</td><td>527</td><td>493</td><td>459</td></tr><tr><td>5,000</td><td>568</td><td>539</td><td>493</td><td>468</td></tr><tr><td>5,100</td><td>562</td><td>544</td><td>498</td><td>483</td></tr><tr><td>5,200</td><td>534</td><td>528</td><td>500</td><td>494</td></tr><tr><td>5,300</td><td>542</td><td>546</td><td>501</td><td>504</td></tr><tr><td>5,400</td><td>549</td><td>563</td><td>500</td><td>513</td></tr><tr><td>5,500</td><td>550</td><td>575</td><td>499</td><td>521</td></tr><tr><td>5,600</td><td>544</td><td>578</td><td>495</td><td>527</td></tr><tr><td>5,700</td><td>534</td><td>579</td><td>492</td><td>533</td></tr><tr><td>5,800</td><td>523</td><td>576</td><td>488</td><td>538</td></tr><tr><td>5,900</td><td>512</td><td>574</td><td>487</td><td>546</td></tr><tr><td>6,000</td><td>499</td><td>569</td><td>481</td><td>549</td></tr><tr><td>6,100</td><td>484</td><td>562</td><td>475</td><td>550</td></tr></tbody></table>
''9 The wastegate is accounted for in the supercharger system's tuning. Here, Stenod Performance's Joe Borschke checks the results of another chassis dyno test that showed Chris Radd's wastegate-equipped car putting down nearly 570 lb-ft and 580 hp to the tires—on an otherwise stock engine, using only the bolt-on blower kit and the custom wastegate.
10 This dyno graph plots the performance of Lou Katz's non-wastegate Camaro over Chris Radd's wastegate-equipped car on Stenod's Mustang chassis dyno. Note that both cars produced the same peak of 7.9 pounds of boost during their respective tests. The dotted lines represent Katz's car and it's clear that, while delivering strong performance, the wastegate combination of Radd's Camaro performs better across the entire rpm band. At lower rpm, where most street driving occurs, the torque advantage with the wastegate is about 70 lb-ft.
<table id="ctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_ctl01_ctl00_dlVendor List" style="width: 618px; border-collapse: collapse;" border="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td style="padding: 5px; width: 608px; vertical-align: top;" colspan="2">SOURCES</td></tr><tr><td style="padding: 5px; width: 299px; vertical-align: top;">Stenod Performance
248-307-0056
www.stenodperformance.com
</td><td style="padding: 5px; width: 299px; vertical-align: top;"></td></tr></tbody></table>
<aside>
</aside></article>
Turbo technology for your supercharger
By Barry Kluczyk, Photography by Barry Kluczyk *Posted by MCF`Space
We thought a few Member's of the MCF would enjoy the below
We thought a few Member's of the MCF would enjoy the below
<time>Super Chevy, </time>
<article style="font: 11px/normal Verdana; text-align: left; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); text-transform: none; text-indent: 0px; letter-spacing: normal; word-spacing: 0px; white-space: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">
A wastegate is an item typically associated with turbo systems, but Detroit-area Stenod Performance has found great success by weaving them into supercharged engine systems to boost torque. In fact, on a pair of '10 Camaros equipped with identical bolt-on ProCharger centrifugal blowers, Stenod coaxed 60 maximum rear-wheel pound-feet more out of the wastegate-equipped car over the comparable, non-wastegate . At some points on the dyno chart, there was more than a 70 lb-ft advantage.
No matter how you slice it, that's a significant increase, and the path to delivering it is relatively simple--if you're handy at welding and tuning. And it was a solution that Stenod's founder, Joe Borschke, says fits the bill for optimizing blower performance across a broader rpm range. "We've been really impressed with the fit, finish and general performance of the ProCharger systems for . But they don't seem to make as much torque as they do horsepower," says Borschke. "That's primarily a function of the boost curve of the centrifugal design."
When it comes to supercharged power, positive displacement superchargers (Roots and Screw-type) and centrifugal blowers produce it differently. In simple terms, a centrifugal supercharger's boost increases exponentially with engine speed, while a positive displacement supercharger's airflow is linear--with maximum boost occurring very low in the rpm band. That means a Roots or twin-screw blower that delivers, for example, cubic feet per minute (cfm) of air at 2,500 rpm will push 1,000 cfm at 5,000 rpm. A Roots or twin-screw blower makes a small amount of boost whenever the engine is running, while a centrifugal supercharger's boost builds in a non-linear way, much like a turbocharger. As rpm increases, the airflow from the compressor will increase at a faster rate. Because of that, maximum boost is not achieved until the engine's red line, or maximum rpm level. So, the centrifugal "rolls" into its boost, and is generally easier to launch, with a stronger feel through the mid-range and upper rpm levels.
- 1 Lou Katz's '10 Camaro makes about 550 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque at the tires on the Mu
- 2 The red Camaro SS of Chris Radd uses the same blower system as Katz's Camaro, but emplo
- 3 Both cars in this story are fitted with identical bolt-on, intercooled ProCharger syste
"We've installed, tuned, and dyno tested a bunch of ProCharger systems upgraded to the D-1SC compressor. You can pretty much bank on them making 550 hp and 500 lb-ft of torque at the wheels, with about 8 pounds of boost," says Borschke. "We wanted to get more torque out of them to make the cars feel stronger and more fun on the street. We turned to the wastegate, then started experimenting with smaller-diameter blower pulleys to push more torque higher in the rpm band. "In a , a wastegate bleeds off excessive exhaust gas pressure to regulate the speed of the turbine. It's the same idea with a centrifugal supercharger, the compressor of which performs similarly to the turbine of a turbocharger.
"With the wastegate, we can spin the blower faster to produce greater boost, and bleed off the extra pressure that's not necessary," says Borschke. "This allows the boost to come on much sooner, gaining midrange power--especially torque--that you can really feel on the street. But more importantly, it helps maintain the right boost for to prevent detonation in a stock engine. "Of course, there's a fine line to balance with the size of the wastegate. Stenod uses a 44mm unit on LS3 Camaros, which Borschke reports is plenty large enough. "If you go too big, you bleed off too much pressure and go backwards on power," he says.
- 4 Detonation is a big concern when force-feeding the Camaro's LS3 engine, as its fairly h
- 5a These side-by-side shots show how the wastegate is integrated into the blower's airflo
- 5b Stenod Performance splices between the compressor's discharge outlet and the intercool
"You'll never miss it on the street," he says. "It's a small price to pay for the greater feeling of power in the mid-range. Heck, the right cam change would help alleviate that high-rpm deficiency, too. "Check out the accompanying dyno chart and graphs, you'll see the dramatic differences with and without the wastegate. As Borschke mentioned earlier, the standard kit delivered the expected 550 rwhp/500 rwtq numbers, while the wastegate-equipped car's best numbers were 579 hp and 568 lb-ft of torque to the tires. That's about 6-percent greater horsepower and 14-percent more torque.
A closer look at the numbers is more revealing: The wastegate-equipped car crossed the 500 rwtq threshold by 3,700 rpm. That was 1,000 rpm sooner than the other car, and it held above the 500 mark through 5,900 rpm. The non-wastegate car flirted with 500 lb-ft only between 5,200 and 5,400 rpm. It's a similar story with the rear-wheel horsepower, where the non-wastegate Camaro peaked, of course, at the 6,100 rpm limit. The Camaro with the wastegate hit its peak a few hundred rpm earlier; and it bested the other car's peak prior to 5,400 rpm. Of course, we had to ask about the bottom line on this modification. "Generally, it's about $600 for the cost of the wastegate and installing it," says Borschke. "There are tuning implications, too, so it's better to do it with installation of the kit. It would cost more to retro-fit a wastegate on a car that already had the blower system installed and tuned." So, on a blower system that costs approximately $7,000 to purchase and have professionally installed, the wastegate upgrade represents less than a 10-percent premium. In bang-for-the-buck terms, that seems like a deal to us.
- 6 This is a typical external wastegate normally used with turbo systems, but similar to w
- 7 The wastegate's large valve is pressure-activated, meaning it opens at a preset pressur
- 8 Because a centrifugal blower doesn't make peak power until the very top of the rpm rang
Chevrolet Performance's Blower-Ready LSX376 Crate Engine
Sure, there are plenty of bolt-on blower systems for the 2010 Camaro, but if you plan to really turn up the boost, you'll want to consider a purpose-built short block with lower-compression, forged pistons. That's what you get in Chevy Performance's LSX376 (part number 19171049) crate engine. It combines the economical and strong LSX Bowtie standard-deck block with the Camaro SS' production LS3 engine's high-flow, L92-style cylinder heads and camshaft – along with a durable set of forged aluminum pistons that deliver a blower-friendly 9.0:1 compression ratio that is crucial for avoiding detonation in high-boost combinations. The Chevy-orange color of the iron cylinder block looks great under the hood, too. The LSX376 is available from any Chevrolet Performance Parts dealer (meaning your local GM dealership's parts department) or online at gmperformanceparts.com.
A New Blower Book
Super Chevy contributor and author of the main story above has written a book about supercharging and turbocharging the LS engine, titled--appropriately enough--How To Supercharged and Turbocharge GM LS-Series Engines. It is a full-color book published by CarTech, and went on sale this past June. It covers the basics of forced induction, follows the installation projects of blower and turbo kits, and offers detailed chapters on building an LS engine to support high-boost combinations, with numerous sidebars highlighting real-world projects. Go to Cartechbooks.com for more information, or visit sites like amazon.com to order.
Dyno Chart
<table rules="cols" cellspacing="2" cellpadding="2"><tbody><tr><td></td><td colspan="2">With Wastegate</td><td colspan="2">No Wastegate</td></tr><tr><td>RPM</td><td>TQ</td><td>HP</td><td>TQ</td><td>HP</td></tr><tr><td>3,100</td><td>243</td><td>143</td><td>168</td><td>99</td></tr><tr><td>3,200</td><td>411</td><td>248</td><td>243</td><td>148</td></tr><tr><td>3,300</td><td>460</td><td>287</td><td>335</td><td>210</td></tr><tr><td>3,400</td><td>482</td><td>310</td><td>400</td><td>258</td></tr><tr><td>3,500</td><td>489</td><td>324</td><td>421</td><td>280</td></tr><tr><td>3,600</td><td>497</td><td>339</td><td>430</td><td>294</td></tr><tr><td>3,700</td><td>508</td><td>357</td><td>439</td><td>308</td></tr><tr><td>3,800</td><td>516</td><td>372</td><td>447</td><td>323</td></tr><tr><td>3,900</td><td>522</td><td>387</td><td>456</td><td>337</td></tr><tr><td>4,000</td><td>528</td><td>401</td><td>461</td><td>350</td></tr><tr><td>4,100</td><td>537</td><td>418</td><td>458</td><td>357</td></tr><tr><td>4,200</td><td>543</td><td>433</td><td>466</td><td>371</td></tr><tr><td>4,300</td><td>549</td><td>448</td><td>472</td><td>385</td></tr><tr><td>4,400</td><td>555</td><td>463</td><td>479</td><td>400</td></tr><tr><td>4,500</td><td>561</td><td>479</td><td>488</td><td>417</td></tr><tr><td>4,600</td><td>564</td><td>492</td><td>493</td><td>430</td></tr><tr><td>4,700</td><td>566</td><td>505</td><td>491</td><td>438</td></tr><tr><td>4,800</td><td>568</td><td>518</td><td>493</td><td>450</td></tr><tr><td>4,900</td><td>567</td><td>527</td><td>493</td><td>459</td></tr><tr><td>5,000</td><td>568</td><td>539</td><td>493</td><td>468</td></tr><tr><td>5,100</td><td>562</td><td>544</td><td>498</td><td>483</td></tr><tr><td>5,200</td><td>534</td><td>528</td><td>500</td><td>494</td></tr><tr><td>5,300</td><td>542</td><td>546</td><td>501</td><td>504</td></tr><tr><td>5,400</td><td>549</td><td>563</td><td>500</td><td>513</td></tr><tr><td>5,500</td><td>550</td><td>575</td><td>499</td><td>521</td></tr><tr><td>5,600</td><td>544</td><td>578</td><td>495</td><td>527</td></tr><tr><td>5,700</td><td>534</td><td>579</td><td>492</td><td>533</td></tr><tr><td>5,800</td><td>523</td><td>576</td><td>488</td><td>538</td></tr><tr><td>5,900</td><td>512</td><td>574</td><td>487</td><td>546</td></tr><tr><td>6,000</td><td>499</td><td>569</td><td>481</td><td>549</td></tr><tr><td>6,100</td><td>484</td><td>562</td><td>475</td><td>550</td></tr></tbody></table>
''9 The wastegate is accounted for in the supercharger system's tuning. Here, Stenod Performance's Joe Borschke checks the results of another chassis dyno test that showed Chris Radd's wastegate-equipped car putting down nearly 570 lb-ft and 580 hp to the tires—on an otherwise stock engine, using only the bolt-on blower kit and the custom wastegate.
10 This dyno graph plots the performance of Lou Katz's non-wastegate Camaro over Chris Radd's wastegate-equipped car on Stenod's Mustang chassis dyno. Note that both cars produced the same peak of 7.9 pounds of boost during their respective tests. The dotted lines represent Katz's car and it's clear that, while delivering strong performance, the wastegate combination of Radd's Camaro performs better across the entire rpm band. At lower rpm, where most street driving occurs, the torque advantage with the wastegate is about 70 lb-ft.
<table id="ctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_ctl01_ctl00_dlVendor List" style="width: 618px; border-collapse: collapse;" border="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td style="padding: 5px; width: 608px; vertical-align: top;" colspan="2">SOURCES</td></tr><tr><td style="padding: 5px; width: 299px; vertical-align: top;">Stenod Performance
248-307-0056
www.stenodperformance.com
</td><td style="padding: 5px; width: 299px; vertical-align: top;"></td></tr></tbody></table>
<aside>
</aside></article>
#3
#5
Thanks Andrew for your post & good words on
Stenod Performance
248-307-0056
www.stenodperformance.com
How's your friends Talon run ? (Those are some fast rides) Is your friends a AWD ? Clean ones are getting hard to find on the Auto Market (they are in demand by many)..They kick some butt
#6
Thanks Andrew for your post & good words on
Stenod Performance
248-307-0056
www.stenodperformance.com
How's your friends Talon run ? (Those are some fast rides) Is your friends a AWD ? Clean ones are getting hard to find on the Auto Market (they are in demand by many)..They kick some butt
It never got a full tune in it. Yes it was AWD, had some one-off pieces in it.
Aluminum rod 2.1L
10.5:1 compression
Custom built 81mm turbo
not sure if you'll be able to see it, but here's a picture
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater
100% street driven and street legal
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jd1101
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04-27-2012 12:32 PM
10, 468, boost, carlo, centrifugal, compression, fun, low, monte, power, roots, small, street, supercharger, superchargers, wastegate