99 Lumina LTZ supercharger
#21
haven't really decided to go with Cartuning Performance 3800 Turbo Kit, they are saying it will fit but may need some modifications..
does the M90 just bolt on even for non-supercharged engine??
also keeping in mind I have to pass emssion test with this machine too..
found a 98 GTP thats rusty.. for 1500 only problem it has 260,000 km's on it.
#22
Couldn't you run the SS MPS 4.2" with a top swap? It would make the swap easier too in that you wouldn't have to swap balancers?
Stock pistons are hypereutectic (sp)- and there is no way you're going to 'blow threw' them unless your tune is really really bad- or you've got monster KR; in which case, forged pistons aren't going to save you anyways.
No one has found the HP limit for a totally stock bottom end...
No one has found the HP limit for a totally stock bottom end...
And I agree completely on using a ZZP turbo kit over a Cartuning kit- the ZZP offerings are excellent.
#23
Is it just a regular OBD2 test- or do you live in Cali? If its just regular OBD2 test, it will pass with the SC just fine- all emission equipment stays intact.
No it's 25/25 dyno emission test
They test at idle for
Co% and Hydrocarbon
then they do a running test on dyno test for:
NOx,CO and HC
No it's 25/25 dyno emission test
They test at idle for
Co% and Hydrocarbon
then they do a running test on dyno test for:
NOx,CO and HC
#24
Well, I wouldn't be too confident in our stock pistons- these hypereutic (hyperpathetics) slugs suck.
I don't disagree that forged pistons are going to be more resistant to knock- but you're talking spending well over $1000 (between the pistons and engine rebuild) for a mod that doesn't make you any faster and makes the car less reliable (the failure rate on rebuilt 3800s is awfully high for whatever reason).
The only thing it really gains you is the ability to get sloppy with your tuning or modding- I say just watch what you're doing in the first place. Not to mention, you could buy 3 or 4 stock short blocks for the price of forged pistons, all the rebuild parts, and machine shop work.
To me, thats like saying you need to go buy a hardcore built transmission because sometimes you aren't careful and reverse drop it- and the built tranny handles that better; if you were careful and watched what you were doing in the first place, then it would be totally unnecessary, you know?
Don't get me wrong- I used to be all about the forged pistons- I even spent almost a grand on them, plus another grand for the machine shop work. All it gained me was a little extra noise when cold, a little extra power from the .1 extra compression over the L36 bottom end-definitely by far the worst mod I've ever done because it was totally pointless. I figured that by how easy the pistons chip when you get a ton of knock, that meant they were weak and that we were close to finding their max power limit- but people kept pushing them, and now they're doing nearly 1000 crank horsepower with them- so I was completely wrong, and I wish I'd have spent the money on all the expensive bottom end hardware, and such on other go-fast mods.
I do agree that with a proper tune, you don't have to worry about the pistons- but if you're recording any KR, you're basically counting on your knock sensors to work to keep your pistons from fragging.
#25
well A im not bull****ting you B no i wouldnt have the most powerful 3.8 in the world that would be taken by a 96 camaro with 840hp out of a refabed 3.8 bored to a 4.0 and c i dont have a scanner to scan the dyno test hell i dont even really have net till next week when its hooked up been at the library cause verizon internet service time sucks but when i get my net up il try to get a pic of the dyno run up, and i rounded to the closest number with my hp its 767.859 so 768 its pretty close but never the less the ht pistons that bumpin is talking about was only in the supercharged 3.8's if i remember correctly the plain jane 3.8's came with flattop slugs not bowled pistons
#26
and i rounded to the closest number with my hp its 767.859 so 768 its pretty close
but never the less the ht pistons that bumpin is talking about was only in the supercharged 3.8's if i remember correctly the plain jane 3.8's came with flattop slugs not bowled pistons
Lots of power has been made on the L36 pistons- just not quite as much as the L67 pistons (mostly because the big power guys run big boost, and want the lower compression anyways)- but I've never seen a failure of an L36 piston from too much power anyways. I suspect if anything- the wrist pin would go before the piston since they're a good bit smaller than on the L67.
#27
ok here is a list of my major and minor mods to the 96 "LSX" (lumina ls) cam machined by comp cams short throw piston arms forged titanium turbo pistons from j&e crank machined at penntech with a slightly shorther throw vtech heads off of a chevy 3.8 with roller rocker rod system (eliminates alot of engine noise) 2 turbonetics t30 turbos pushing 25lbs of boost total turbo cooling and breathing unit by greddy , injectors by ingen "not ment for the 3.8" but with thread modification they fit right up high pressure fuel pump high flow fuel filter oversized fuel line shaved heads port & polished block heads and headers high flow aluminum radiator and that wierd little chip that suposedly increased hp and fuel milage the hp part i believe but but the fuel milage no you want power you eliminate gas but anyhow 2.5 inch drop kit by some off brand , manual transmition set with custom made short shift kit (couldnt find one whoda guessed) stage 2 performance clutch tuned gearing i have no idea what the guy set it up as, that did the tranny for me but it burns rubber at 35mph in second high pressure driveshafts aftermarket heavy duty wheel mounts and brackets hollowed cats straight pipe shoved through dual all the way back to flowmaster 40's
and the dyno part the hp rating at the top of the paper said 767 but the graph was closer at the peak to 768 but not quite touching it
and the dyno part the hp rating at the top of the paper said 767 but the graph was closer at the peak to 768 but not quite touching it
Last edited by BlackMagicGm; 09-09-2009 at 11:14 AM.
#28
twin turbo set up pushing 18 lbs of boost
2 turbonetics t30 turbos pushing 25lbs of boost
3.8 is bored .4 over so i had to have machined pistons to fit the sleaving
I'm shocked that you can even go that far on the bore even with sleeving; here is a pic of a 3800 block:
http://www.thrashercharged.com/image...ne/engine9.gif
Bumping out each cylinder .2" towards each other (almost 1/4")- meaning you're taking almost 1/2" of sealing space away from the area in between the cylinders- I don't see how you're keeping a seal in there.
short throw piston arms
forged titanium turbo pistons from j&e
crank machined at penntech with a slightly shorther throw
vtech heads off of a chevy 3.8
roller rocker rod system
total turbo cooling and breathing unit by greddy
injectors by ingen "not ment for the 3.8" but with thread modification they fit right up
What do yo mean by thread modification to injectors? Our injectors don't have threads on them, just an oring on each end.
Also, any link to these injectors? I went on Injen's website:
http://www.injen.com/index1.asp
Thier product list shows: air intakes, exhuast systems, turbo components, air filters, accessories, hose couplers, pre filters, apparel, and cleaning- I couldn't find any injectors on there at all.
high pressure fuel pump
headers
wierd little chip that suposedly increased hp and fuel milage
manual transmition set
burns rubber at 35mph in second
the top of the paper said 767 but the graph was closer at the peak to 768 but not quite touching it
Ok, time for more questions:
-What are you using to tune the PCM?
-Still running the stock PCM setup, or did you switch to an aftermarket system?
-What kindof tires are you running? (size & brand)
-Are you intercooled, what size is it, A/A or W/A?
-What head gaskets are you running to hold all that power?
-What do you run in the 1/4 mile?
Now I'm not trying to be rude- or call you out, but some of this stuff just doesn't make sense.
For example, you claim
767.859
http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...mode=1&smode=1
The highest number on there for a turbo setup is 619 wheel horsepower- so you're claiming to make 148.859 more horsepower than the highest guy on there? If thats the case, you need to get to the dyno with a camcorder- and post that up on clubgp- you'd be by far the highest 3800 FWD dyno'd car- only the company sponsored cars would even come close.
With that said, there is a company sponsored car that makes more power than the highest on that list- the ZZP TTGT; making 753 whp and running 8.65 in the 1/4; and you claim to make 14.859 more horsepower than them!
Dyno proof:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEHbt...e=channel_page
1/4 mile proof:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1IBL...eature=related
Even at full street weight- you should easily be a 9 second car- thats why I'm so curious what you do for a tire and transmission combo.
Hopefully that clears up why everyone is so skeptical.
#29
ok here is a list of my major and minor mods to the 96 "LSX" (lumina ls) cam machined by comp cams short throw piston arms forged titanium turbo pistons from j&e crank machined at penntech with a slightly shorther throw vtech heads off of a chevy 3.8 with roller rocker rod system (eliminates alot of engine noise) 2 turbonetics t30 turbos pushing 25lbs of boost total turbo cooling and breathing unit by greddy , injectors by ingen "not ment for the 3.8" but with thread modification they fit right up high pressure fuel pump high flow fuel filter oversized fuel line shaved heads port & polished block heads and headers high flow aluminum radiator and that wierd little chip that suposedly increased hp and fuel milage the hp part i believe but but the fuel milage no you want power you eliminate gas but anyhow 2.5 inch drop kit by some off brand , manual transmition set with custom made short shift kit (couldnt find one whoda guessed) stage 2 performance clutch tuned gearing i have no idea what the guy set it up as, that did the tranny for me but it burns rubber at 35mph in second high pressure driveshafts aftermarket heavy duty wheel mounts and brackets hollowed cats straight pipe shoved through dual all the way back to flowmaster 40's
and the dyno part the hp rating at the top of the paper said 767 but the graph was closer at the peak to 768 but not quite touching it
and the dyno part the hp rating at the top of the paper said 767 but the graph was closer at the peak to 768 but not quite touching it
I really don't care if people make things up on the internet, except when it could give people looking for information the WRONG information. The post I quoted is full of very "wrong" information and should be disregarded by anyone searching for information on how to make their N/A 3800 Monte Carlo boosted.
"Vtech" heads- maybe he means "VTEC"? LOL
#30
Burns the tires at 35 mph? With 700+ whp, you shouldn't have traction under 60 or 70 mph on DOT approved tires. Even if you drive around in this thing on slicks, I still don't see it only burning the tires at 35.