Alright, so I have read the previous posts, and already done alot of research, but WizKidd's suggestion to me about getting a turbo was not taken lightly. I have been doing some serious consideration, and am really thinking about either a turbo kit, or a whipple supercharger.

I am going to try to use this post as more of an experience, versus opinion. I am not looking to start heated debates in which everyones OPINION gets involved. Just a simple friendly discussion between people who have either upgraded their blowers (M90) to an M112, Whipple Supercharger, or blocked off the snout and upgraded to a Turbo. I really am curious as to what kind of power increases that those that have upgraded are receiving.

And, as always, stating that I am going to need to upgrade my engine's internals goes without saying. You can't run stock anything if you plan on getting into the lower 12's.

This site has been great to me, and I appreciate anyone's input on this thread! Thanks in advance!

i've never heard of a whipple supercharger...whats the difference between that and ours?? does it bolt up directly? and whats the cost??

Direct from site:

We're glad you asked. The M90 (or any roots blower for that matter) pales in comparison to the twin screw Whipple supercharger. Why? Eaton blowers are just that: blowers. They do not compress the air; they simply supply the engine with more than it needs at any given rpm, resulting in boost. The downside to this is that these blowers are adiabatically inefficient. They are harder to spin and have exponentially higher outlet temperatures. The Whipple on the other hand is a true supercharger, compressing the air in it's housing, resulting in significantly lower outlet temperatures, an easier to spin supercharger, and an unparrelled power when compared to other superchargers.


http://www.wbodystore.com/images/tomwrightdyno.wmv

that video is great, you can hear it kick in. Sounds like a small infant screaming. HAHA

And here is the sales link:

http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/animul-performance-whipple-kits-new-p-25.html

Hope that helps

-Keegan

http://www.wbodystore.com/grandprix/images/whipple1.jpg

3299$ wow, tad bit pricey, but i'm sure worth the gain, what kind of mods to you need to do to your monte to bolt this beast on??

and how does that thing fit under the hood! lol

Well, It looks like next to nothing. as far as mods. Literally bolt off the old one, and bolt on the new one. I mean, obviously, having a new camshaft, transaxle, forged piston heads, etc will only be the beginning so that this thing can really perform.


But did you hear that video!? Craziness!!!!

Size wise, it says literally only an extra inch, which, considering you would no longer have that pretty little 3800 series II cover, with pretty writing saying supercharged, im sure clearance isnt a problem...

That, coupled with a ram air hood hooked to an airbox meant to work with a ram air, think of the power!!!

yah that would definetley be nice !!! if only i had the money to buy that :) man that would be sweet!!

Well, luckily, I am young, stupid and have a little extra money to throw around.

Anyone else have input? :)

It seems like only the moderators have input. LOL

That video was amazing i love the sound of the superchargers on any car.

I would say if you wanted to go all out with your car and try to get the fastest times youshould go with the turbo.

But then if you wanted wheel burning power to go with the whipple S/C
and the supercharger sounds better than a turbo

wow! i love the sound of that! do you know what the hp gain is from one of those??

well, it is looking like it all depends. But let me put it this way:

They state that an m90 running a 3.0 or even smaller pulley with a modified engine PALES in comparison to a STOCK Whipple.

Not to mention getting any girl you want at just a touch of the pedal with that wonderful noise coming from under the hood!

:)

Okay, so I just got an email from this company, and here was his response to my question about how much air this pushes:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Keegan, it will fit on any L67, yes. Hood clearance might be an issue but actual fitment won't be.
Whipple only makes a handfull of "kits". They also sell their various blowers for use with other applications where the customer makes an adapter for the supercharger. In this case the supercharger is a Whipple and the adapters are ours.

The blower displaces 2.3liters of air per revolution.

I then emailed him back, asking him the ACTUAL size of this item, he replied with:

Keegan, it's about 1/2" shorter than the stock blower.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

SUPPOSEDLY we are talking about like, roughly 20-25 psi.

I dunno where else to look for information on this blower. Seems too good to be true for a price tag of only 3200. I mean, the biggest reason I would choose this over a turbo is because of the extra mess of running more lines, a more cluttered engine bay, and more moving parts = more chance of me messing something up with the turbo install ;)

The Whipple is a nice upgrade, but so far doesn't touch the turbos available. This topic has been beaten to death on other websites such as mymonte.com and clubgp.com.

Over the last year or so chatting and speaking with some of the more informed people on both sites (Lav74, and Bumpin96 on mymonte and zoomer, animul, and troy at Club GP), that these haven't really been popular upgrades.

On the high side about 20 people or so are running M112's and there are about 4 or 5 total people running Whipples.

Here is a diehard link on ClubGP regarding the Whipple. http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.asp?m=3722654&p=&mpage=1&tmode=1&smode=1&key=wh ipple&language=single

It is a powerfull addon but if you look at the mods on the cars that have the Whipples they simply have dropped thousands of dollars into these engines and don't have the payoff the turbo's do.

The M112 is a beast in its own and really isn't that popular either.

After everything is said and done if you are just trying to bump your car into a beast, consider doing a GenV swap. If you are going for balls out power, think Stattama turbo and that will drop you into the low 12's in full trim with no weight reduction.

There just hasn't been enough development on the Whipple yet and the M112 just isn't very popular.

The Whipple is a nice upgrade, but so far doesn't touch the turbos available. This topic has been beaten to death on other websites such as mymonte.com and clubgp.com.

Over the last year or so chatting and speaking with some of the more informed people on both sites (Lav74, and Bumpin96 on mymonte and zoomer, animul, and troy at Club GP), that these haven't really been popular upgrades.

On the high side about 20 people or so are running M112's and there are about 4 or 5 total people running Whipples.

Here is a diehard link on ClubGP regarding the Whipple. http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.asp?m=3722654&p=&mpage=1&tmode=1&smode=1&key=wh ipple&language=single

It is a powerfull addon but if you look at the mods on the cars that have the Whipples they simply have dropped thousands of dollars into these engines and don't have the payoff the turbo's do.

The M112 is a beast in its own and really isn't that popular either.

After everything is said and done if you are just trying to bump your car into a beast, consider doing a GenV swap. If you are going for balls out power, think Stattama turbo and that will drop you into the low 12's in full trim with no weight reduction.

There just hasn't been enough development on the Whipple yet and the M112 just isn't very popular.

Damn Charter internet. =P

Sorry for the double post.

Actually lets put this more into perspective funds wise at trying to get to low 12's.

Whipple is $3300. You are also going to need to look at: larger injectors, fuel rails, cold air intake, t-stat, plugs, and possibly throttlebody. May also need to consider cam, heads and headers. Finally you will also need a programmer. When this is all done, you will be looking in the $7,000 arena. Possibly more and a big negative is that there aren't any intercoolers available yet. So you won't be able to get the 20-25 lbs of boost that is thrown around.

Cartuning turbo kit with the intercooler is about $5100 and comes with most of the stuff needed. You might want to consider pems/powerlog to help with the exhaust. You may also want a programmer as well to tune it to your car. This should put you into the mid-low 12's for about 2 grand less.

Stattama will also work and ZZPerformance historically has been a better company to go through if you read the last 2 years or so of forums from multiple boards. Matt has his head on his shoulders and will help customize your setup rather than out of the box. When it is said and done it will be a much better turbo system but cost about a grand more bringing you up to around $6000.

The GenV will get you there with a lot of other mods as well and cost the least amount but you will be spending a ton of time under the hood to accomplish it. I would say about the $4000 arena... possibly $5000.

On a personal not I'm hoping someone can throw about $10,000 at the Whipple for research and development and bring this thing out into the daylight. Unfortunately it is just a hyped up pipedream at this time until someone puts the effort into tuning it and beefing it up. Troy seems to have the best bet with all the money he has thrown into his engine.

Alright, great! Someone that is knowledgeable with turbos. Alright, so let me ask you a question... are you running a turbo on yours?

Also, do you have some contact information for this company? Because if what you are saying is true, I should be able to email them, and they should be able to give me a recipe for success.

I think that my biggest fear is that I do not want the turbo lag that alot of people talk about. You step on the gas, and there is a 2-3 second delay. Well, at least that is what I have heard. I also am hesitant because I have heard that turbos will KILL your engine internals alot sooner than a supercharger, because it is pushing SO Much more pressure into your engine...

I have also had alot of people tell me "It's not the Chevy way, blah blah blah" But I can justify it if I am whooping the crap out of some ricer that comes down the street even THINKING he has a chance.


I really do appreciate your help on this, and I look forward to a response :)

ORIGINAL: ExplosiveSoundz

Alright, great! Someone that is knowledgeable with turbos. Alright, so let me ask you a question... are you running a turbo on yours?

Also, do you have some contact information for this company? Because if what you are saying is true, I should be able to email them, and they should be able to give me a recipe for success.

I think that my biggest fear is that I do not want the turbo lag that alot of people talk about. You step on the gas, and there is a 2-3 second delay. Well, at least that is what I have heard. I also am hesitant because I have heard that turbos will KILL your engine internals alot sooner than a supercharger, because it is pushing SO Much more pressure into your engine...

I have also had alot of people tell me "It's not the Chevy way, blah blah blah" But I can justify it if I am whooping the crap out of some ricer that comes down the street even THINKING he has a chance.


I really do appreciate your help on this, and I look forward to a response :)



Ok, lets hit these 1 at a time. First I'll readily admit I wouldn't consider myself "knowledgeable." I understand the theories, and the mechanics but have no real life experiance installing them, playing with the boost, or understanding their power charts. I HAVE committed about 6 months of forum notes to memory though.

As for contact info: Stattama@aol.com This is for Matt Meekhof. This guy KNOWS what he is doing with turbos. Check out his page for some great info as well http://www.stattama.com/

Turbo lag is pretty much a thing of the past. It still exists but not as much as "the old boys club" says. Also in the grand scheme of things with the power that becomes available through a turbo in our cars smacks the hell out ofthesuperchargers. They just keep the air cooler do to their design. I still say that the supercharger is a more reliable unit. I haven't heard of any turbos taking a dump though.

As far as it's not the Chevy way is a bunch of horsesh!t. Chevy DEVELOPED a TURBO MONTE CARLO in 1980! http://home.flash.net/~rjgeorge/montecarlo.htm

This was the predecessor to the Buick Grand National which is one of the most recognized cars in the world. Once again a GM product and both were 231 engines.

To smack them some more, the first EVER production cars wither a turbo were an Oldsmobile Cutlass and a Chevrolet Corvair in 1962. It wasn't until a decade later that a nondomestic used a turbo. Read this Historyso you can smack the naysayers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbo

It really wasn't until the Fast and Furious came out that everyone jumped on the "turbo's for ricers"bandwagon... one that needs to have the wheels come off.


Hope this info helps ya!

Well, I just sent an email off to 3800 performance asking them the recipe for success. I also am going to forward the same email to Matt, and see what I end up with. I really just want to know if I am going to end up having to change out the piston heads, or if I can get away with everything but that. But if I can end up putting a turbo on my monte, with mostly everything stock, and still beat the crap out of even a souped up mustang ( typical time for a mustang cobra with new catback and headers is 12.8) then I will be doing excellent. Not to mention the sound, is just incredible when you hear that turbo spinning up at a redlight ;)

Thank you so much for your advice! I hope that one of these few gentlemen will be able to give me sound advice since I have emailed them.

Actually here is some email info I sent about a year ago. The Cartuning kit is quick to put it but is limited, Stattamas is customized. It really depends on your goals. After doing alot more research I found that my goals are limited to low-mid 12's. I want to keep my interior the same and fully functional. 11's are just out of the question for me and my goals.

Rob @ 3800performance is pretty good to work with, but he is the middleman. Kevin at Cartuning is the guy you would want to talk to. Also Rob doesn't have any "experiance" with modding cars. He is basically a guy that put up a REALLY good and informative website and farms everything out. ZZPerformance is the spot with experiance. They cost more in some situations, but the products are of higher quality and they have a VERY experianced staff.



I'm looking to replace upgrade from the M90 SuperCharger on my 2004 Monte Carlo to a turbo kit. After researching the forums I'm still undecided as I don't have any conclusive information. I have narrowed it down to either a turbo from your company or the Cartuning turbo.[/align][/align]What I am looking for: Mid 11's and very good reliability on a daily driver without slicks or weight reduction.[/align]
To start out- this is a pretty big goal. Getting enough traction to run mid 11s is not going to happen with street tires. If you are talking about running ET Street radials or something, then maybe. But it would still require about 500 WHP to run mid 11s in that trim.[/align]Their upgraded turbo "should" do the job in the high 11's with the stuff I have, and they havemuch more info on their website,but it's still $5,075 with the intercooler. 9.01 1/4 miles and alot of cars on clubgp shows experience hence the reason I'm looking to you.
They do offer a complete kit that has been proven to work. However, I don't consider it a premium kit that can go to 500+ WHP. We have been there with several cars and can custom build your kit to match the power that you are looking for.[/align]
[/align]With what I currently have, what do you have that can beat what they have. I like their Air-to-Air intercooler and I've seen that you have cars that have them, but nothing available on the website. Also I don't see enough info on tracktimes with the upgraded turbo options or reliability. The Stattama turbo is advertised running 10's, but it doesn't say what the addtional mods needed are or what the reliability is.[/align]
We offer Spearco air/air ICs as an upgrade and they are considered by most to be the best. Turbonetics turbos also come standard as big-shaft units. This adds some strength. They also have a 1 year unlimited warranty on the turbo.[/align]
[/align]So what options can you hook me up with such as the Stattama, T-62, etc and what would installation costs be if I go with your company?[/align]
I would recommend a alrger turbo for the goals that you mentioned. Our T66 or possibly a T70 kit with headers would be more suitable for your goals. I can quote you on custom kits if you would like.[/align][/align]Thanks for your interest in our products.
_______________________________________________

Matt M

I found this one as well in my email history talking to Zoomer and referring to Clubgp.com:



Honestly, there really is no comparison from the CT kit to ours other than that they are both turbo kits. No CT cars on our forums have run mid 11's but Stattama has 3 cars in the 9's, many in the 10's, etc. I recommend our T66 turbo and I will have Matt give some more of the details.[/align][/align]
Zooomer
ZZPerformance.com[/align]

well, I emailed zz like you said, and I anxiously await a reply :)

Alright, so I sent an email out to ZZ performance, and he decided that because I am looking for an everyday driver, that is reliable, and easier to work on, he suggested that I stick with an m90, upgrade to (a gen v?) and upgrade my engine internals. Since I have heard from alot of people that all I need is a pcm upgrade or a thrasher shift kit (which we discussed earlier) then I think this is going to be the best way to go. I will end up getting a machined snout, getting a 2.8 pulley, and upgrading all of the internals. "Zoomer" stated that with these conditions, I can be running low 12's in the quarter, and ultimately, my goal is just to be able to keep up, if not surpass those stupid lancers that run a 12.9 :)

SO, that being said, where the heck can I get a GEN V Eaton Blower? What is the different between what I have and a Gen V?

However, I am glad that you steered me away from the whipple, as more and more research online is proving that the company's blowers cant compare to an m90 pushing a 2.8 pulley with engine internal mods. :)

-Keegan

gen V blowers are what comes on the L32 the newer 3800 SC motor from i think 2004+ (might be 05) i think ZZP has them

Yeah the Gen V'scome on the 04+ Grand Prix's. The Monte Carlos got all the hand-me-down Gen III's

This is ALOT of work and studying. I'm talking like over a month to get an idea where you are going to go. You simply can't drop a 2.8 pulley and get away with it. You're still looking at about 3-6 grand in mods.

I'd start with the simple stuff first:
CAI - I love my Wizaird from ZZP and they've dropped them in price since last year.

Downpipe - might want to combine this with getting Headers.

Catback Exhaust - This is your own choice but I recommend staying with the 2.5 diameter.

Headers - Think TOG's!!! Avoid the SLP's. If I could do it again it would be TOG's and downpipe together.

Programmer - Either DHP or HPTuners. If you wait a month or so, I can send you the generic upgrade from HP Tuners that everyone pays $100 for, but if you want to go Gen V supercharger you will need your own programmer to take care of the accompanying Throttle Body for the Gen V and to program fuel trims.

180* T-stat - about 10 bucks anywhere.

Autolite 104 spark plugs - Big debate on who has the best plugs, but across the boards most modders run Autolite.

Finally drop a pulley and enjoy. Either 3.5 or 3.4 - you will want to have your programmer by now.


Now you start to save up cash for the bigger upgrades. You will have dropped between 1000-2000 into the car at this point.

Gen V and lower intake and Throttle Body is what I'm going to do once I get my programmer. I made the mistake of not getting the programmer right away and I'm really regretting it. :(

Get all 3 items at the same time to save yourself some headaches. You can assemble it and play with it a bit before installing it. You can get familiar with the setup. When you do this you can expect to drop between 700 - 2000 on this upgrade depending on how you aquire the parts.

[Shameless Plug] By the way, if you want to get a cheap downpipe I'm selling mine. I changed to SLP headers and needed to fabricate a whole new downpipe for my setup. I'm selling my Random Technology pipe for $240 plus shipping. http://www.montecarloforum.com/m_38800/tm.htmShipping will be about 20 bucks. [/Shameless plug] :)

As for Gen V info, here is a bookmark I've been reading about once a week for close to 2 months and always discover something new: http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.asp?m=3036177

Once I get this taken care of (hopefully by October due to money), I'll continue to update what else needs to be done. It will be put in the Do-it-yourself section like I did with my SLP Header install.

Don't want to do a thread HiJack, but for more info on my downpipe for sale, here is where I got it and info on it: http://www.3800performance.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=RT-DP-CAT&Category_Code=ES_H&Product_Count=13

The quicker someone buys this, the quicker I can get my programmer and get experimenting with a Gen V.

Well, in addition to all of those things, I am also going to be going to 60# fuel injector kit, along with a new camshaft from intense racing, and new forged pistons. I planned on dropping that much money anyway. The money is not the issue. I want reliable. I want something that I can drive, day in, day out, and not worry about blowing anything up. Once I change my internals, and get the exhaust changed out, My goal is to get a machined m90 snout so that I can drop down in pulley size. Along with a gatorback goodyear belt.

My goal is, this winter, to start rippin her apart around December, and have her back together and ready for tuning within 2 months.

And as far as complications, I am a Sikorsky Blackhawk Helicopter Engine mechanic. So a v6 is the alot easier compared to a turbine engine pushing 1700 horsepower. :)

Only problem is, there are alot more variables when it comes to car engines. A turbine is easy. Replace the shaft, the accessory drive, end of story. But with cars, it is never that clear cut :(


I will continue to search however.

Okay, so seriously, I'm not trying to be a baby, but I have looked EVERYWHERE on google and across the web for m90 gen V superchargers. I emailed Zoomer and he told me he that he is out of stock, and has no idea when he is getting them in, and I emailed Eaton directly, and they are giving me the run around.

So, Where in the heck do I buy this thing?! :(

ORIGINAL: ExplosiveSoundz

Okay, so seriously, I'm not trying to be a baby, but I have looked EVERYWHERE on google and across the web for m90 gen V superchargers. I emailed Zoomer and he told me he that he is out of stock, and has no idea when he is getting them in, and I emailed Eaton directly, and they are giving me the run around.

So, Where in the heck do I buy this thing?! :(


EBay. It's just a matter of time that someone posts them. It may take a month or so before you will see one unfortunately. :(

This happens to be a high demand mod and alot of modders just offer them to someone in their car club. Also finding them brand new is next to impossible so we have to wait for someone to total out their 05+ Grand Prix and then hope it gets posted on Ebay.

It actually does happen more often then you think though... at least once per month there is one on Ebay.

LOL!!! Time to be the first person to snag a Black Hawk turbine you work on and shoehorn it into the Monte. =D

RWD Midengine kind of like a Tucker. :)

It would definately turn heads then.

Hey, don't think that I haven't already thought of that! So, basically, I am screwed for getting a brand new one :(

I really had my hopes up too. lol Oh well, guess I will be doing daily searches on ebay. :)

ORIGINAL: ExplosiveSoundz

Hey, don't think that I haven't already thought of that! So, basically, I am screwed for getting a brand new one :(

I really had my hopes up too. lol Oh well, guess I will be doing daily searches on ebay. :)


You have a chance yet, but you're best bet to get a new one is from ZZP. A slightly used one is very good as well.

Just don't bid against me when I see one. =D

Well Like i said though, Zoomer was not very helpful. He seemed very standoffish. I asked him when he would be getting them in, and he had NO idea. How can you not have an idea as to when you are going to be getting a product in for your business? :(

ORIGINAL: ExplosiveSoundz

Well Like i said though, Zoomer was not very helpful. He seemed very standoffish. I asked him when he would be getting them in, and he had NO idea. How can you not have an idea as to when you are going to be getting a product in for your business? :(


That's easy to figure out if you've ever owned or worked for a small business. They have no idea because Eaton - who supplies them - has no idea when they are going to ship their next batch.

Eaton has a monopoly on their supercharger and they really don't cater very often to small companies. They spend more of their time working with GM, Ford, and Dodge which is understandably so. The last thing you want to do is loose them for a contract. Who would really care if you loose zzp's business. Eaton stands to loose maybe and that is a BIG maybe 100 supercharger sales. If Eaton lost the one of the big three they would be loosing thousands of sales in the near future and 10's of thousands in the long term future of 10 to 20 years.

So Zoomer really isn't being standoffish (he's actually a pretty cool and honest guy) but he's a low figure on the totem pole when you consider the other businesses out there.

I understand how that works. It is a shame that money talks, not honesty anymore :(

So, when I get home, lets you and I go shove some 05Pontiacs off the road ;) Cause I WANT ONE! :)

There has to be SOMEONE to buy these things new from! :(

Hi Keegan,The other optionI've really enjoyed reading your informative post, & Dan's replies.The modifications seem very expensive, but a great challenge.I know that I may be young & dumb, but to invest thatmuch money for the performance advantage, Iwould first look into investing into an 06-07 V-8Monte Carlo that was designed & built with all thecomponent's &structure for performance (Engine structure, susp, trans, etc, plus you have a factory warranty on a 06-07.I don't think it would take much to geta V-8 SS in the 12 second bracket. The price for the V-8 SSare coming down & there are some great buys out there.You have an awesome Black Monte V-6 SS(Super `sig 2).Have you ever considered gett'in a V-8 SS, & just enjoy driving,instead of constantly spending your time $$$keepingthings together on a highly modified Monte Carlo.Just something 2 consider ?I know when I was mod'in, I spent all my time & moneywork'in on my car, & everyone else was surf'in .Really enjoyed your post...Thanks & Good Luck withyour decision /project......`Space

Hey Space, thanks for the suggestion. You know, it's funny, because my friend just said something to me about that the other day. He asked why I would rather buy a used 04 and put so much money and time into it, when I could just buy a newer one that goes alot faster.

Well, my reasoning is this:

I've never done a whole lot of modding on newer cars, it has always been on older cars with my dad, (i.e. 36-38 Chevy Coupe, etc) so this was going to be my project car. I bought it with the strict reasoning that this was going to be my car which I sat down to and worked on in my free time after everything else was done. I already have 2 other cars, so this one is just for fun. So I do appreciate the suggestion, and if I were smart, I would probably consider it. But this car is going to be my new project car, and since my dad has since passed away, and Monte Carlo's were his passion, and he had always dreamed of completely restoring an old one, this new one will have to do.

So, in a nutshell, thats that. :)

And from what I understand, onceI finishmodding the car, and do everythingI need to, this will be a daily driver with minimal maintenance (i.e. oil changes, etc)

And believe me, you aren't young and dumb. Only a mere 11 months younger than I.

Take care!

-Keegan

Hey Keegan,Thanks 4 your reply, & I respect your lovefor making your Monte your project car.I'm sure your fatherwould be proud.You sure are lucky to have so many cars,plus a shop/tools to enjoy your work.Good Luck & Keep the MCF informed.Please post some `pic's.You have a beautiful SS`Spacehttp://www.animation-station.com/racing/images/car003.gifhttp://www.animation-station.com/racing/images/car007.gif

Kinda the same here. I'm just not looking to mod a V8. It's so much more fun to fly by someone that has a 350 and when they ask "What do you have under the hood!?!?!" you can reply with a straight face or slight grin "just a 231". :)

That and the Intimidators interior is much cooler than the 07's. [sm=pimp.gif]

Haha, I agree. For someone to pull up at a red light beside you with a v8, and a v6 to blow them out of the water, is well worth the money also.

Another consideration is price. A new Monte costs about 25,000. A used 04 costs about 12,000-15,000. Add about 5 grand in mods you have a total of 20,000 and a much more faster and fun car.

It really depends on what your outlook is. Some people would sooner have the newer vehicle.

Well, I agree. If money was tight, and this was the only car, and I had a really long drive to a job everyday, a newer car would be the way to go. And the 04 Intimidator is a new car, just not as new as the 06-07 Montes. You are quite right however, Even 10 grand in mods will give you a wicked fast car, for cheaper than a new ss small block. :)

okay, so back on subject, I found this company.. but they are calling it the generation IV


Is this really just like a gen V?


http://www.magnusonproducts.com/mp90.htm

Also, in addition to that, I found this intercooler mount for the m90...

i dont think I would ever spend 2400 bucks for it, but I might just be crazy enough to do it......


http://www.thrashercharged.com/L67_htm/new_cooler.shtm

I would avoid the Thrasher products all together. I just really don't care for their products as the competition always seems better. Comp cams over theirs for instance.

For the intercooler, ZZP is the place to go once again.

http://www.zzperformance.com/grand_prix/products1.php?id=234&catid=139

Ohh One more quick reason to modify the 3800 and not go for the 5300.

Simply because "The Chicks Dig It" :) (Chris Cagle) http://www.lyricsfreak.com/c/chris+cagle/chicks+dig+it_20030159.html

Nice use of lyrics! lol.

But do you seriously think that the GenIV is the same as the GenV? Maybe mistaken title? I emailed the company, still got nothin back :(

Hey 04 Intimidator, I saw you have an account over on clubgp.com


It looks like you are still waiting to upgrade blowers until after whipple has more proven results?

I think its either gonna be a gen v, or a whipple, haha, but the turbo has definitely gonna be ruled out, mostly because I love the sound, the feel, and the kick that my blower has.

Yeah, I have an account here, ClubGP, MyMonte, LS1M, and half a dozen other sites that I really don't visit as much. The first 3 is where I spend most of my time.

Yeah, I have an account here, ClubGP, MyMonte, LS1M, and half a dozen other sites that I really don't visit as much. The first 3 is where I spend most of my time.

As for the GenIV and the GenV; there never was a GenIV. Magnuson just screwed it up is all. Eaton skipped it for some reason that I've never gotten a decent responce on.

I'm actually not interested to much in the Whipple. Yeah it would be nice to have and it sounds Kick Ass!!! But it just costs too much. I just showed some interst there just to see if I can through a bit more peer pressue to see if those guys will start building up more. :)

I'm just going to go Gen V and be done with it.

Yah, I agree. The cost seems a little much for something that seems to have the same performance values for the GenV.

I'm gonna email that company that I showed you, and hope that they can give me a rough cost of the new Gen V from their site. I would love to get a brand new one...