It will be interesting to see how this washes out. Dont you need a boost gauge etc. like the SC have? Before you have them do anything I would get a written contract outlining their work agreement and any possible upcharges etc. if things dont go right. Try and establish a bottom line. This will be something to keep us all posted on, take pictures and document this if you can to share with us here.....

 

He got an N/A, no boost...

 

I've got full documentation, of everything. Including the VIN # of the car it came out of....hmmm I should run a carfax on it... signed paperwork from the guy at the salvage yard too...got about 3-4 papers of signed and documents for the purchase

 

One of the main reasons that people do engine swaps in base model cars (or lesser model) is because they don't have to pay higher insurance rates or higher registration. Plus it's a good experience where you can learn a lot from it.

A top swap is beneficial because you get the advantage of the higher compression ratio (9.4:1 instead of 8.5:1) thus making more power.

An LS1/4 swap is done to our cars just to be unique usually.

jwjones, to answer your question on whether you can just drop in an L67 or not (even though you're not going that route), it takes a bit of work. If you want to keep your stock tranny (which is beneficial because you have the better gear ratio of 3.29:1 vs the 2.93:1 in the L67 car's tranny), you will have to have a custom PCM. Your Monte will not run without the tune. If however, you take the L67 and it's tranny, all you have to do is swap the engine tranny wiring and PCM. Nothing custom needed.

Another thing to think about is what Chibi said. If you do the intake gaskets and valve cover gaskets yourself, then you will only spend a little over $100.

Just some food for thought.

 

Thanks for the input Zipper, but like I had said, the motor has over 200k miles on it. Its either time for a swap or a rebuild. Rebuild will just cost more in the end

 

No problem. Personally though, the only reason I would do a full swap is if my 3800 was burning oil. Otherwise, these engines will last a LONG time. My engine has about 160k miles and I'm not worried at all. A guy on clubgp with a Grand Prix was putting down 385whp (when he wasn't running nitrous) and his engine lasted over 260k miles (shattered a rod). So I wouldn't be too worried with our 3800's unless you're burning oil.

 

Shes kinda burning oil. Every now and then on a cold start she wont start on the first turn. Sometimes she'll burn oil on first start up for about 10seconds

 

i didnt realize insurance or registration was a reason why anyone would want to do this swap. i dont know the laws in your state, but here in jersey your registration is the same price whether its a pinto, or a 69 big block rs/ss camaro. i cant imagine that the insurance price would be all that different for a 10yr old ss monte as opposed to a base model car, but ok. i agree its a good learning experience just not something some one should dive into with no experience and with out a reliable daily driver. ive done full drive train swaps and hot rodded my daily driver. its far from a fun time when you have to have the car up and running every morning.

it makes more power with a larger pulley, but one would have to assume with more compression would come more knock. its a plus and a minus. id rather have one factory built.

i think you misunderstood when i said the 3800 camaro fbody guys swapping in an ls1. by that i wasnt referring to the monte carlo. i was talking about the 98 and up camaro and firebirds with the 3.8 in them. people that go out and are like let me swap an ls1, trans, rear, interior, spoilers, and what not. at the end of the day they have a patch work car that cost as much as a ls1 car would have cost that no one in there right mind would want to buy from them if they decide to sell it.

ls4/1 swap into the 6th/7th gen monte is what it is. its great to be different and i applaud the effort, but its pointless. you can buy the car with that setup in it. well the ls4 at least. ive only seen one ls6 swap in a impala that wound up in a gp, one ls7 in a monte, and one ls4 in a 6th gen, and one ls2 rwd convert(all three on here) ls7/6/2 cars are awesome, and obviously not something that could be bought at any used car dealer.

anyway my whole point was it seems like a good idea to do a drivetrain swap till you take everything into account. if its your daily driver and you cant get it up and running quickly youre screwed, its not necessarily cheaper than buying one that came like that(when people total these builds they never take into consideration the hours of work they have to put into it. they just total parts, but your time should be worth something. not to mention unforeseen problems), and now the car is modified buyers may shy away from it(which personally i would unless it was an older non computer controlled vehicle. you can never really know what some one else has done to the car, or there level of skill. to many hands running through one car is never a good thing.) like i said i have nothing against doing things on your own, daring to be different, or whatever. i just find it to be a pointless time, and money consuming venture when the drivetrain desired has come in several models including one of the same exact body style.

 

I can understand your points MonteMan, especially if your car is a dd. That is hard to have a strict deadline to get the job done.

About your point with the 3.8 f-body, that kind of goes along with my cheaper insurance/registration. It sounds like you guys in New Jersey are lucky when it comes to registration. In Michigan, registration costs are based on what the vehicle cost when it was brand new. That's the one crappy thing about Michigan. But I'm happy that we don't have vehicle inspections here

 

You could've used the same trans had you went the L67 - 4t65 route, the pcm just needs the correct tuning for both (zzp sells a drop in pcm or anyone local with DHP/HPT can do it for you real quick). However, if the whole setup had over 200k on it- I think you'd be better off replacing both just to get the mileage down on both. Seeing that you just got an L36- have you ever rebuilt your stock trans?

Sounds like you got a decent deal!

If you plan to drop it in and leave it stock- you're exactly right, a full- low compression - L67 is best. That way you can just rock premium fuel, and keep the knock at stock levels and never worry about it.

However, for those planning to mod, the high compression is an advantage. Once you get below the basic pulley swaps on an M90 (ie 3.5, 3.4, etc)- they start putting out tons more heat for small additions in airflow. At that point, they're really being driven outside of their efficient range and heat input starts to become a big problem. These cars always seem to put down better numbers running high compression and a normal pulley size rather than low compression and a much smaller pulley. It would be totally different with a turbo kit or csc, where you have plenty of room to increase airflow without going out of the efficient range of the unit- you could up boost with just moderate extra heat input; but its a totally different game with the stock M90's.

I totally agree- which is why I recommend in my L67 swap guide to have some sort of plan B daily driver just in case. Only person I'd think could get away with not is an experienced mechanic- but for most of the regular joe's on here, you're best off to have a plan B in case everything goes wrong. I am a perfect example of this- my monte was my first swap, and first major mechanical project. What should've taken a few days took almost 2 weeks due to having to go in extra hours at work (busy season) and a host of problems with the swap (before it was well documented). If I didn't have another DD at the time, I would've been screwed.

I can definitely agree with this. Main reason I did an L67 swap on my monte was buying an 04/05 SC monte would've cost far more than just doing the swap. Being a 96 base model, my monte wasn't worth much- and at the time, the SC montes were just a few years old. I did get more into GP's later- and that would've been a good option too (actually it is what I bought for my DD after spending a couple years building my monte's engine)- but still cost at a minimum 2-3x what my monte's value + the cost of the engine swap was.

For those who want an L67, and are open to different Wbodys (ie GP's), I definitely think it is cheaper now to just buy a used GTP. But for those who want an LS4- I could still see a swap being a viable option since the LS4 montes are still a bit high in price (say compared to an early 00's base monte plus the price of a swap).